Jan 7, 2014|
Garland talks with the Anti-Defamation League's Christopher Wolf about whether cruelty should be allowed in the comments sections of websites.
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Automatically Generated Transcript (may not be 100% accurate)
Well were think -- about the -- converts. This article and comment sections of some would term view of the Internet today. At some stories that you'd like to and Google and -- room that you -- skewed -- would have more detail of what we're talking about. More and he is pro Libya but could -- by bio. BI -- where -- try to mix. Nancy comments. Our T. On the Internet when it comes to comments. Truth may take a beating. Truth -- -- -- how to bring the -- ringing in June machine. And here's -- Obama adolescent of the Yelp lawsuit. Online reviews are over rated. What the issue noses. Here's another bidding on -- and customers can now find themselves in court. So. It it's long been part all of the Internet and -- -- -- from one of these articles this would -- Mixed blatant bigotry. Report -- at a vegetable apps. Topical for the violent threat and there you have it on line column and scourge of the unit. Blading and limited blame politicians going human nature. A growing number of web sites reining in the wild west of online commentary. Companies including Google hoping -- many others. Are trying every rating from deploying model brokers to Portugal used their real ingredients. In order to restore civil disk works. Then some sites or -- -- -- again -- you're to me. Is the key. As I believe and we've got a couple of experts criminal and told me wrong but why pick duplicate. The efforts. Put site's. News no words -- efforts of clamping down on this limited. Minimized. The government -- sites in the delicate position. Call outs the longer visitors to -- to breed the pope's. And the more of becoming. The more they click. The more a -- can charge for advertise. And I submit. It's not as much anymore about journalism as it is those clips and him when you pull up the Huffington Post. Serious news on the left and I mean everything but portable side -- on the right. Boardwalk. Because the American public can click on the right more than and that obviously in -- -- Let's find out -- wrong got a number of there's a little bit of credence woman thinking -- world -- -- just. And that privacy attorney Ian leads -- Internet task force of the anti defamation. Christopher Walken surely do pretty -- to talk. All right guys in my thinking in the wrong direction that and if so where would one of London's. Well Portland media ultimate resource that your listeners can can look at to. This last year when the match and directors into defamation league he talks. Called bottle. Containing it spread on the Internet. Available on Amazon courts and we addressed that issue. And our top title this viral -- -- Through the -- and I'm going well. And we're glad brilliantly that you go and call you back the. And you know are we need to that level that you're a little bit because -- in some values. In and there's real treat for people to be able to use the Internet without being identified. I'm practicing lawyer principally. And online privacy obviously is a major issue today and and uses of -- It shouldn't have repeal that they sacrificed that right privacy simply by virtue posting a comment on the web site or social network page and in the in the US we had a great tradition -- ominous political speech that -- to pack two of the Federalist papers. And we also note that dissidents in oppressive regimes. Elsewhere around the world. Have felt free to speak up precisely because they believe that they can't be identified in the -- they would be subject to really harsh. Harsh treatment. And so there is there certainly are circumstances in which anonymity played really important social role as the. You -- my limit -- limit erupted there. But when it comes to journalism. I did television news for twenty years. Somebody wanted to do replied to a mid -- of the anti Kumble and on camera had to beat him had to be there. If liberal literature of the yet determined that moves the newspaper checked the blue book that's where they live -- room there -- the related letter. I understand if you're whistle blower or if you you've got something it's dangerous. Broke we come -- what you're talking about. Anger and hatred. That used to sell advertise. Well. The news that the Internet is being polluted the people hiding behind the shield. Could match. Basically. Not to say really horrible and probably more importantly Ford purposes. Public -- things that are totally off topic. And you. And so wrong in terms of web site and Africa is that I think more and more -- that those kind of comments are you. And that the court and -- them that they aren't going to be things that will cause more visitors to their site. And so -- -- that are in the in the defamation league are capped an eight. More and more companies. Are coming up with mechanisms to promote. Real name identification war. Ways that exclude these kinds of hate filled comments that we don't. Which had a real name policy. And some other company that also -- to -- to change his policy. Here. To require real name precisely because they all the garbage is being -- it when people couldn't have to take responsibility. What they've posted I think. Do you disagree I think there's a trend among commercial sites. Towards mechanisms to do away he built -- comment and -- have more meaningful post. And I have to go along with the I've been to -- -- too broadly lead out. What -- going to discuss today. And and made it sound like this is where it is this way and always will be wearing. The very articles. I've suggested people -- and read during or after the show. Suggests of exactly -- -- and number of large companies in particular. -- -- Turning round and in changing or rehearsing -- the coward commoners. -- come back -- let's talk about what that means because. I've always been told by a reporter bring to mind that your of their being told look headline. Headline that outline. You've got to get somebody to click columnists in the UK and say. Oh there's trouble in the Middle East the -- -- fighting rebels and Syria. You you've got to say babies being killed by rebels and Syria. How does -- that can work. You have. There or not the news. Outrage and he proved comments. He did so many people click Colin in read in -- to come right back Garland rob but it -- we called to drink. This -- -- about to do the Atlantic. Magazine and a return this article. That has quotes like there's -- good -- like the Internet it's just an outrage machine. Social milieu seems like repetitive cycle of angry in rage portal wars I every comment sections. And threats. And the guests that we have this important time personable Internet privacy attorney leads the Internet has ports in the anti defamation league pointed out the that I was wrong and and framing this as something that is and isn't -- change. Look developed and YouTube and Google or road changing his Google is changing it on their Google+. Program. Huffington Post is changing and the largest 137. US newspaper. Those -- newspapers. Those -- daily circulation book the 2000. Nearly 49%. Benton anonymous. Comment and certainly here. And popular science weren't big so it's magazine also ended recently. Of Christopher. How are they gonna sell time everybody I've talked to him in journalism. Say this is one of the the ways that they. Tell how many time peoples are drawn -- the web site. Well there other we'll monitor that as well I think they're recognizing that we get in the -- -- that people are really getting turned off the pollution. -- off topic comments. That you know what people don't -- responsibility what they say when they close. And so I think it is really positive trend in one other thing I think we need to focus on that this is happening. Without. -- And in fact probably no law could be passed although there have been some urges state legislature. Requiring. The requiring names when things are posted. War imposing liability for extreme viewpoint. The First Amendment that you and your listeners probably knows extremely broad. And this is not a province of lawmakers and the fact that -- stardom legislating your. You might be a Lebanese really important speech. As an unattended unintended. -- so it to good thing that that is the product itself regulation. And people like you thank you for bringing attention to that issue. Bringing attention to the issue because it is as clippers' issues that -- the rose in the last couple leaders and people recognize the Internet was being -- By really mean spirited people but also by people who. Normally in dated today. Relations are not that people are not haters but it is something that. Getting behind the screen. And feeling empowered and having anonymity because people who do really. Terrible things as we point out and -- by eight. The one. Solutions here one unit and we -- -- -- -- long term. We need to pinch hit. Almost every level elementary and middle school education about her responsibility program literacy. And at what they say and do does matter can hurt other people but also support themselves because of people like but there. -- -- You know we've seen with the revelations. That it pretty easy for the government and others to track what people are doing and in May come back by the as they apply for schools are applied for job and so people need to understand -- need to take responsibility into line and I think we'll all be better -- In your blog -- age did you look at the question now. Wall a is this recurring hasn't always been endemic of the human animal. The -- they view these these hateful things but. And never has the Kurds are seldom had the courage to tell somebody pace of these other. Terrible lawsuit of bureau of this or is it something that it's that new engine operated by new technology. -- elderly -- defamation league video just celebrated its 100 anniversary and that its mission is prepared and semitism and promote justice. Pampered treatment for all about children and we fight hate. And when we concluded sadly we're going to be here and other yours hopefully more than that because -- has always been this and will only. That's what we've seen with new media and technological tools. Is that they're now out for hate. And ways to become a worldwide publisher -- But never existed before. -- that -- other people to join you and egged them on and make it in normal and commonplace and in ways that before. You know haters used to meet down dark alleys and you'd distribute that material plain brown wrappers and now with a click. On the computer device. They can spread their hateful messages so they're really two categories you've got the hard court haters who frankly are only going to be with a steadily. I'll admit that he will -- not thinking. I'm thinking people -- some of them think -- a body that day means people discriminatory. And others that the longer side. And oh. It and you know in terms of the publication vehicles and but it's one that that -- millennia -- You wrote a book on this huge sodium on a regular basis. In the writing of your -- anything surprised you did did you. Hit information. Where it was something you hadn't really -- when you decide to write the book. So that. Surprise that the vote the issues that in places like Germany poll. Where it is literally. Unspeakable -- -- -- now been denied the error. But not the Europe. The law for -- speech really haven't been very active. And it -- that ended up making martyrs. Many of the people who prosecuted. And they had their Paul promote their work. Oddly enough -- the -- where they can publish it without fear important because first. And so what that. This is not a legal issue -- -- open book lawyer. But we have a chapter. In quote entitled there ought to be law in which we conclude the relation. Because the laws now well suited to deal. I don't think going in to the writing of the book but our research we did a what does that mean that we have. Societies take on the responsibility and importantly card company had to step up and protesting and they have obviously he Angel. And have their -- for the -- and security on and on their own sites. And I actually speaking -- right now from Palo Alto, California because tomorrow and Thursday will be meeting with these and how we need greater. To talk about as practice and ways to eliminate the pollution -- that useful legitimate helpful. Productive contents can really important torture including journalist in the. One when you say that a bit of fun and where he's of revenue. That replaces. I think period there -- a million people is zero or that moment -- with their comments. They're more people that read them and and promote and by talking about them even more have any of these big portals. So do you. It's gonna reduce a lot of clicks in this category. Ball we can make it up boss. Actually they tell me something entirely different regions more and more advertisers as saying we'd be associated. With hate speech. There was. Episode last day in which the women's groups objected to speed with which it what was taking down misogynist anti Whitman. Comments based on catching them there responsible company debate -- dealing with -- you can imagine challenge that -- built. -- any event he went to that group. Actually went to have a advertisers. You know FaceBook -- The -- as we think they should at some appetizers and we wanted to come all your your service. Until the suspect's. And so there was some power and I think more more advertisers recognize they'd be associated. I would hate speech. So I think it just took a contract with the commercial. In seven nauert or hard towards. Site content that doesn't promote hate. Your book Merle -- is Josh -- Peru will signature on it or was it. Dual authors. If it was dual -- -- co author is the national director of the anti defamation league Abraham Foxman. Who is holocaust survivor. And who observed in the book. -- did not start it is the other -- since they started with words. Words of hate that then turned in to propaganda that the that it turned into society. That they're both. -- undertook to kill minorities by the millions and also some of what does look the other way. And that word really do have power this is very pretty trivial issue by any means. And and I know. From my work as an Internet lawyer. Over the years I've seen them the power of words actually -- -- real world hate crimes. -- the holocaust museum. 8788. Years old hat day white supremacist web site was egged on and so haters online child. They have with a gun and killed. In cold blood as Stephen Johnson holocaust museum guard and problem with a much more damage before he himself which. Are at. As we note that was the product -- veto -- We're brotherhood Tomlin portrait we've been crucible we're gonna reserve -- right -- -- get to back again look to continue. More Disco -- and send veteran particularly like talk to you about. The candidacy controversy in -- or organs and scorn -- the accused -- -- -- -- Greg Newton yeah. Its role in the privacy attorneys wrote a book called flight rules he come objects. Pastor practice in the improvements business -- specializing. In so fool me.