WWL>Topics>>1-21-14 2:10pm Angela: on children and the reward system

1-21-14 2:10pm Angela: on children and the reward system

Jan 21, 2014|

Angela talks with a panel of moms about whether its harmful for every child to receive awards or trophies simply for participating in an activity rather than for be exceptional. Panel includes Dr. Lauren Giovingo of the LSU Health Sciences Center and Lisa Phillips of Children's Hospital, as well as mothers Trish Kaufman and Lizette Rivera.

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Automatically Generated Transcript (may not be 100% accurate)

Well it's a topic that many have strong feelings about should every kid in the game get a trophy. Should kids get rewarded for simply showing up. Does getting a trophy even if you lose. Really Bill Self esteem. Or does send a different message. If sports offer teachable moments. Then isn't it located teach kids how to handle losing as well as winning. I know you have an opinion on this. Are we giving out too many trophies I have to mention it's now three billion dollar business. Let's hear from you 260187260187. The Chilean call we have a studio filled with great parents returning I'm so happy that you're back who have thoughts on the subject. Trish Kaufman a mother of two. Doctor -- Revere. Mother of two with another on the way she has a Ph.D. in psychology. Doctor Lauren -- -- bingo. Child psychologist and a member of the clinical faculty at the L issue Health Science Center school of allied hill. And Lisa Phillips parent educator at the parenting center children's hospital and also a mother of two. In the eighth and eleventh grade so you all are the authorities. You are authorities because you more parents and you are thought around about the subject so right off the -- I'm gonna throw out. What is the matter. With making every kid feel good about participating in something. I actually think that there's a difference between net. And actually needing to re board the fact that children have participated in something -- just acknowledge and praising the fact that. They denigrate. And way to get your effort. Verses actually physically having to give them something and something so significant. Because I think it demeans the rest of when you know you actually do learn most valuable player or something along those lines. It isn't quite is important because everyone else gets the trophy too so. Doesn't single anybody out which people could say is a good thing but at the same time I think it takes -- that sort of competitive nature that's just realistic and life her. I was gonna add to that that you know I think what we I'll -- -- parents and as professionals we think about what -- where we want our children to be in the future. How we want them to act how we want them to work what their work work ethic will be. And I think that's part of is that the reality of our alliances that sometimes they went and sometimes we lips. Sometimes we do a really great job and sometimes we struggle and that's okay I mean that's what I say all the time it's okay but. You know I was talking to some of -- Mom and -- friends last night and one -- brought up a really good teachable moment for her children and she said. You know around the time of the Super Bowl. You know they were trying to get in the playoffs recently. Daddy didn't make the playoffs with a team. They had to teach their children and it's OK it's OK to be disappointed it's OK to have this feeling but guess what you get back up and you work harder so you -- You -- what you work for. I was gonna say that when you well first I think at a very young age. I don't think at a at a young age novel with the first introduced to sports I don't think it matters either way but it somebody's gonna be rewarded. When they're just developing their skills and I think all of them show -- because they're very young. But as you get older. I -- that. When you're just for any innate ability giving the trophy for just showing up toward. Just being on the team at all. How they can cope. With. When things come happen in life and their failures I mean we lose a lot. Often more than we win and we have to know how to be resilient and to get happen. Like he sent you -- -- from an age issue so yes that child 456. Then then it's OK for everybody in the -- I picket I think it -- it like and it's as if you're starting a new job even as an adult if you're newly into something. And they want you to be motivated they offer you a commission or a bonus. With children I think if they're just getting started in the sport. Then no that's fine when they're really young but as they get older I think by the age actually you would know this more Lisa -- There at some point in their development they -- -- at a very young age that. That this person is better than I am right. I I think that's at him I am gonna disagree with your little that I think you know baby start learning right off the map and with praise for rolling over we praise them for rolling over and we really encourage them to do something and they might not get to be able rollover and then there'll ever and we praise them. I think it's -- -- reward children as long as we attach meaning to that rewards soon. Instead of having on a soccer team a three year -- which I've recently been part of and on every kid on the last six day of the soccer practice. Get the trophy and it's not attached to thank you for. You you're getting this for good attendance or you're doing getting the leading the fastest player or your getting this they can still all get trophies. But let's attach some more on. Direct meaning to so they don't know why right. Right there then a sizable player or there the best helper or. What -- -- player rights so that they still feel like it worked really hard and yeah I'm coach's best helper and and on the best kicker and instead of just blanketing. The trophy and -- recent experience with them that the blanket trophy is. My -- still really has no idea what I got it because he self selected time the entire time on the six. Today any got to trust me and I was so disappointed and I was looking at the cuts going I need that he does not. He has not worked for -- If he's gonna sit on the sidelines and cut up. And he doesn't need the trophy today maybe tomorrow he can get Turkey but not today because. His performance was not up to par wasn't up to and I don't want to reward that -- So what is that message when that kid gets it for doing nothing and beyond nothing not doing when he should've been doing. Entitlement. And I didn't practice a day I just say I didn't comment they're entitled to get whatever they want whenever it and that's not what we -- teacher to. 21 of the things maybe that the intention is with the trophy for everyone is to be inclusive and to make you feel like part of the team and that is a huge part of being in sport is that feeling -- I did this with my team and my son hasn't Turkey's -- from just from participating and he'll go back and look at him sometimes and say hey remember when I was on this team in this. These -- these kids and that's more of a memento of the experience. I think what is distressing to people is that a trophy. We all it symbolizes achievement rather than participation in our minds and it's deluded that that kind of recognition that you associate with a trip he gets deleted if everyone gets. I think it's kind of nice to have something to remember the team experienced my baby that can be a team. Vote isn't exactly at right there right by a certificate of baseball cap whatever right exactly right OK gang stay with -- -- -- some phone calls to stay with the stroke. We're gonna talk about are we giving away too many trophies to kids will be right back and Angela under the W well. I -- the subject and I love the people in this room because their parents who care and they're just thinking about our next generation. Our subject today is are we giving away too many trophies to kids. Literally just for showing up on the team. And it's it's a very interesting discussion -- from Biloxi you have some thoughts on this channel. -- and other way to do it very good I'm glad you brought this subject it's a subject that comes up in the box out there all of my take on it out Little League coach for like two years here. 910 -- group in 1112 Euro group. Personally I like you know look trophies at in her. -- into these are for all of which is. Per barrel -- the entitlement were built in problem for the kids. Because -- do so that we in the championship figured they would it trophy and move -- -- respect app in the -- a special MVP trophy or so war. My take on entitlement work comment from there are being. Is these kids show we're. Like eighty dollar pair -- Figure out. You know Nike bad. Baseball like little he would like nine Senior Bowl you know all of their -- -- clinics awful things like that there. And it will all come around. Of course you know the coach in their kids are pitchers you know when Lott should be pitchers all -- lava it's neck and all are saying they should make all our things and in and they think of from the trophy -- -- comparable period. Not being. Responsible with their is if they're -- doesn't make it's -- should make. I agree with them yes not at and I hear exactly what you're saying you bring -- but it goes back to. At what point do you start discussing or helping young kids. Trophy or no trophy realize that in this particular situation. You -- is good news that your frank yeah. And how how delicately do you handle that rather than saying it's my kid he's got the best equipment and he's gonna win. And you're right I think I think that that come along. -- that he would Arco there done that way like pork exports and school they're not apple opens up. And the reality particularly -- a great. Girl try out and make it -- lot is that remotely competitive. It would away it just you know they've -- experienced the game you know and but you think they're reality the winner -- loser really kicks in you know thirteen 1213 year old -- really handle you know are applicable law and not make it. Seeing what not in the war somewhat. But talk to but no with the war but the game and they know whether there Burke. You know -- -- -- state -- you know there's been younger -- you know accept the trophy that. You know they're so excited you know it's trophies. You know what beginner. I don't know whether it figured. I'd you know it's boiling of these kids by the parent. That is the thing -- not one will be trophy at the end of the year I guess that it might take. Joseph I think you raise a really interesting point about the parenting aspect of it because what I was actually we -- discussing during the break is how much of it is that parents pressure of the parents saying more my -- should deserve that answer might -- participated so. They should get a trophy or. You know my kids just as good as your kid or -- knowledge in the fact that that's not realistic and life and everybody doesn't have the same skills that some people excel on certain areas. And others and other areas. -- yeah you're right that it does come from the parents. And I think that. It needs to be stressed that you're not sending your child up for anything that failure later in life because at some point they will be disappointed and they will not have those skills. To learn how to -- they have never developed it to deal with coping and -- -- -- disappointment. That I was listening to someone who works here at the station who works with young people center and he said which I had a lot of respect for. That four -- whether it's the parents who are indulging or the system that he has. That he is seeing more and more young people I'm talking on people in their twenties coming in who have not had to address. Either failure and or criticism. So well there are evaluations. Which is -- the rules on every place now. They're not coping well with the at all -- very very emotional because they haven't been Craig's list. -- -- -- You know for me I'd -- my last point that you were on school rest of that you're good but but from me you know ma oh. The one oh -- coach and she is in exceptionally. Talented. And first you know that he's cute he's practically there aren't any better advocate. You bet he would you know right now between like 63 Carter and an athletic. So for a kid like that we're -- do what he called me all he was always in the tendency you know so. -- sometimes and not people likeable it I mean he'd blow. Things like he's not always try to teach and to not be able to help the younger kids. How do you sell incurred that other he would. He'll never been involved you know what I mean bill never highlight how do you -- like that one is that. Never knew that war for no common you know that you you know you can record been like well come -- back in next year before. How do you -- you get back incurred in their kids to keep trying to not get you know you have to be all on the. That's a good question aren't and we get -- people here to answer Ares I ran up and down. Thank you -- That's a question that he teachers all over the city have to deal with every day so it's not even on this this sports fielder. Or any other and during any other competitive activities. And also happens and cost and how do you motivate that child's view seems to have a harder timers not motivated and that's where he now -- that I do a lot of work with kids and adults and on on how do you motivate children how you make something fun how do you identify one of their teeny weeny little strength. Because sometimes those kids mailing one teeny we will strengthen -- got to find it. And really make a big deal out of it since that's where I was saying he now they're not kid can be the coaches -- And to him maybe that came in most of -- right most improved or something like that as long as yes identify that strength or identify that ask for. Without the -- getting. -- kids just for paying their 99 dollar. For succession that the kid who just loves to play but who's never gonna be great behind right see you want them to play but if you which you. Are saying is you know what we're gonna make use superintendent of the equipment excellent and -- but they still get to play I still don't get all our. And it yes I mean and hard not I. It depends on what age once again. With the younger child deacon definitely. He -- manipulated situation and empower them -- at some point these kids. They might have to just say this sport I can't really good at this in this sport so I can translate that's. That. Positive. Opinion of but I'll let you -- -- -- in other words whatever attribute they might have maybe it doesn't fit with that sport to another might be another sport and then you push them. Into that direction did you wanna try to. Sometimes there's tons of jobs it's around. On activities that we all like that aren't the activity itself city big about the -- industry while I'm not a great actor singer which I'm not. But could I be really good at picking up clothes that they can I'd be really good at helping write the scripts too many on the yeah I be really good at some of those other things where I'm still involved in that activity. But not. Necessarily viewing it or not that's not necessarily the star because all the other people make it happen and well. I think there's something to be sent to that not every team is full of just superstars and means the majority of -- and not blaming just because there's one stand out cannon and Joe's case it happened to be his son. But the team is still full and you may have to build a roster. In in means even you know there's players in the NFL that are second string third string -- -- the plane in the NFL that's the reality of -- that not everybody is perfect. We're gonna take another break beginning of the newsroom with Chris Miller and we're gonna come back and we've got callers stay with this we'll be right back. We are talking about -- giving too many trophies to kids who aren't winning first second or third. Just because they're there is that a good thing or bad. And we've got our super parents with us and our super authorities we also have some caller let's go to drew in Annandale drew. Good afternoon to all mom and little point that I like to make a couple years ago. My daughter she graduated. She graduated from technical and you know went to the pomp and circumstance at all now that he's been out that there -- little certificate. Libya sent directly not if you acute technical book beyond that it learned to read right just below the and wreck on those. -- a little -- so yeah. So what that ought to let you know and to do all summer. To a library court practice leading. And that she got a lot accord all summer. And the next here in part you know on all -- yourself. I think is going to do. It's something. -- -- teaching opportunities from. I am going to panic after. Ireland thanking our bearings are sitting here -- Now but that's a great example and other comments. Imus as we were talking during the break about how a lot of times in our society we over value. Natural ability and anger about new things such -- effort in persistence. And our children developed. Certain strategies. And choices that they make and we praised those things strategies and Alpert and the things that they have control over. Their performances much. Much more likely to -- just -- treatments with his daughter that he told her nephew on this then you could work on. -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- It feels very good to accomplish. You were saying Trisha about something you would read about kids who have been given trophies -- all -- why didn't they become adults issues. And also not not just trophies. Not being permitted to -- by being bailed out by their parents or what ever simple way at some point in their lives when they do. Have a failure they are unable to deal with it. And they would resort to cheating because they chest. Can't -- right so there is I think what we're really saying is there's a way to teach fail here and how to cope wooden form of very young age. And and part of it is that and sometimes as parents we don't think we tell our children things like your so Smart you're so Smart Smart. Is there a downside to that well actually if you're telling your child that when they get their first four grade what are they going to think that going to be tempted to cheat because they need to preserve that sense of being Smart. Are they going to think gliding get a good grade and mom always that there was this march and I you know in -- not Smart. Whereas if we looked at them when they got -- -- their spelling -- they looked at that said wow you spent the whole weekend studying on that and it really paid off we're very specific. In our praise and we point out that we use it -- being back to show them how on it helped them achieve something. We have another caller left. Hello. Thanks for taking my -- It's something. Team sports is about me and -- say. We should it's about that the kids and and the players not so much to coaches. All of the teachers. Weigh in children's lineup they lineup because they wanted to -- And we you don't get to the starting line actually play that starts to get two very -- and the feeling. When we promote the coaches children many times the players know was the -- -- -- -- -- a player and when the better players are sitting on the benches. Many times. And never even get to apply because the -- children and their friends have been promoted. How do you get a child to the continued to have that attitude to keep on signing. And bring -- back to the table -- -- -- the political entitlement needs to be removed and we need to make it more about the players. The players at the end -- once that team win or even I was haven't and that's it. It's better to -- be a good loser than a bad winner. You know and and it too I think I need to encourage our children and most of it's not about the coaches it's about the players remember that. They can hand alarmed. Practice makes perfect human -- that on the bench you can line. And only those that actually get to practice and play they get to learn and become batters so would need to recognize. Lou thank you thank you for calling I appreciate your comments. Sees me every -- stay with this were not finished with a discussion we'll be right back. Well we are talking about the giving of trophies are we giving too many to children who really haven't earned them. And I thought to reintroduce all of our guest today because they're very very special people Trish Kaufman who has a mother to making her an expert. Doctor Lucent Rivera mother to another on the way she is a Ph.D. in psychology. Doctor -- you bingo child psychologist and a member of the clinical faculty at LSU health science center of allied health. And Lisa Phillips parent educator at the parenting center Children's Hospital also the mother of two. Mean so much that you will take time to be here very quickly yesterday we had on a woman. Her name is Jill -- Gardner she's the founder of manners at the heart she's got a program and like schools all of the United States. And outside the United States now trying to integrate. The teaching of manners. From preschool all the way to 67 grade she made a very interesting comment. She was saying that the loss of manners as we've known them really started in the sixties. When we got away from thinking in a corporate cents and as individuals wanted to think we'll think about. In all of the great activist things have happened women's movement African American movement all the positives. But so that was the good part the other part was we became morsels and she feels and this is the thing and one askew she feels very strongly that the worst thing that ever happened was the self esteem movement. That it totally focused on self vs a movement of teaching self respect. Because she feels teaching self respect. Opens it to the broader world that the child to her personal perspective isn't just blocked by the mayor himself. But looks out into the world it just made a lot of sense to me that I'd like your thoughts. I completely agree with that I would say that on. Having self respect that she said it's in the connection with other people. I'm you don't get self esteem or self respect and Mac team and a lot of times I think we miss understood what builds self esteem. And it's not just giving loading kids up on empty praise like you're the best of the best. On it's certainly -- Children need to know that a parent has an unconditional regard for them. No matter what but they also need to know. That there are certain expectations of them and we need to help them build the skills to be competent in their social relationships and that foster's it's a true sense of -- Specter's statement. I would agree. Simply I don't agree I'm glad to hear that -- that main actor really made an. Oppression well we were talking about the sixties in this -- after the break that the this whole truth be movement. Was established after the sixties prior to that it was only for very special occasions to two people can't -- at all. That they became mass produced an economically. Cheaper two by and it fed right into that social system apply. And and hence we have all these trophies and I was gonna say. Also that. You know these children who are playing and they get trophies all the time in their playing something in their comfort zone. I was a tennis player that true peace constantly because I was good -- it but. Went I went on an outward bound and it was so out of my comfort zone could I am not the roughing it type at all. But that accomplishment. And that's how much more to me. Than any trophy could ever did. So I think it is about the self respect. You know well I can do this I accomplishments. Right. We have another caller Steve from -- To protect alcohol and I just wanna say they're threatening. Trophies for everybody especially that it. And -- relates to sports. A lot of people saying it's not about the charges it's not about the churches and rarely back to differ are -- it really is about the coaches. But there are a lot of coaches failed to equalize the psychology sports. To deal with the children the -- thing. Our -- a lot of people participating coaching activities need to be coached and help to cut. I think -- for almost eighteen years. -- have ever seen them when we coached. There are goals that we check for. The league that we play -- extra fees everybody. This year we -- not true. -- achieve the goals that we sent four. So I think you know. Parent. Coach is unrealistic expectations. On the kids. And are really think -- if you want to get beyond. That a lot of these people that are coaching. May be taught how to true in how to interact with. Children and to set the stage for success. Let me ask you something when you didn't give the trophies this year did you have any complaints from parents. Did you have complaints from kids. -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- You're good things as coaches we sure did. In the game and a car that that parents could still out. We. Violate. The rules about coaching we -- -- that we war. They were checked at all and give it to has actually could say you're right we knew that we shouldn't. Spoke with the kids you know like okay this. Point where you actually -- what. Is it. Then you know we turn our attention to what we initially it was out to interact. And how to make yourself better. And how to improve and so what we we didn't accept the traffic we had tortures and -- -- and except the troops completing our. And ever again and embassies in all parents. And -- Oh. That they would agree that part of the Eagles. Not the trophy it's a challenge you picked up that. Perfect now it is perfect but it was TP. Don't ask coach I just wish more people or organizations. Which forced the people coaching. To take in more pro active. Look at. Traction with the kids. You know approaching -- and borders are so much different car and gel aboard planes Parker may -- -- -- -- -- I -- girl you got -- play. Ball. It up and start -- -- talk and five women who would all be crunch could you can't believe that you are saying. Psychology behind. And that's where banks and athletics and. Recital in anything -- -- -- that we see. -- -- Instead it. -- force accepts. Max marker gene maximum goal obstacles that you achieved. You know larger struck for perfection. Steve you're the best the US thank you very very much on television business on campaign I think so we'll be right back Trish Kaufman doctor -- Rivera doctor -- Jew thing go and Lisa Phillips I cannot thank you enough for talking about. Are we given our kids to many trophies bottom line. While I think awards can be a powerful motivated but nonstop recognition does not inspire children to succeed. I think one of the most important lessons and sports just teach resiliency and how to cope with disappointment that he just give. In award for just showing up I don't think you're doing any service to the children. Agreeable that just add the -- that the about the teamwork working together to make each each other matter that would do. And that motivating within -- within yourself and with the team and and Atlanta and all you need. I'm just one stated that parents and teachers can recognize accomplishments. The same time of eight children to do better by acknowledging their efforts strategies. And their choices that they -- -- -- and thank you all our next hour after the news is pornography --