Feb 13, 2014|
Garland talks with writer/director Matthew Cooke about his documentary "How to Make Money Selling Drugs."
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Automatically Generated Transcript (may not be 100% accurate)
We're just completed two days ago law hourlong show on the hypocrisy. Of war on drugs in this country wondered what is causing what it's not doing. And right after that. Some moments and be those from Huffington Post. And the headlines says the most important movies this summer hint it's not the man of steel. -- -- -- -- added to its I think a documentary it's called how to make money selling drugs. And we'd we don't so many shows on this over the years I've talked to regroup and do something on this. Probably. He isn't anything more than already knew that -- when distance is it's. Goes the good of the movie can't leave the theater group without being shocked or outraged at what they've seen. Even if you -- feeling only too well versed in the insanity of the drug -- you won't walked out its don't. Lucky enough to have the against -- rector brighter and their road map if you -- with the men at -- thank you for the Donna. Hey thanks so let's let -- here. Tell me about this huge documentary exposes hypocrisy insanity destructive it's a miracle drug war. Why boy is this gonna lead me stone Bono walk. Core values that the U -- he's done when he locked out but I mean in terms of making the film and adding another felt in this conversation I think. That the question US should we keep doing -- show about this. The question I asked myself and the answer is yes of course it is we need to keep doing a show about this and so laws change. We need to keep doing -- show about this until the United States is no longer the number one. Incarcerate -- of human beings on the planet when he usual about this that we no longer to. Engage in a war on the poor. Which is essentially what the war on drugs terrorism and what it always has been you know at its. I think at its worst and and it's best to become a war on minorities were in the works so the question to me was how light you show. How to -- -- -- so it's a little bit different that speaks to a different audience and so that's why. I called how to make money selling drugs and tried to do it and remorse satirical. Manner but also in in -- -- that reflected. What's really going on the ground from the perspective of the people who get into the drug game I don't think -- You know most for a five year old. Say what you want if the question what you wanna be when you grow up. And they say drug dealer I think it happens because the socioeconomic reasons I think there's ways to talk about that. Which are the ways we've been talking about them before. Move forward get into statistics would cure. Pretty scary about themselves. -- people a couple of pieces of port talk about. It's hasn't lasers the complicity of law enforcement. Talked to me about that. The complicity of law enforcement. Well I mean. Unfortunately because of incentives like the burn great. Which of these grants that the government provides. To law enforcement organizations based on the numbers. Of drug arrests. That they're able to complete we have an incentive. In law enforcement organizations to. Prosecute drug crimes and particularly prosecute drug crimes in neighborhoods where they're not gonna get a whole lot of push back. So. You know it's against the law is the long answer to that. I wouldn't say that all the law enforcement as complicit in this because I know some wonderful law enforcement. Agents spoke. You know in practice now in -- -- say that the war on drugs is terrible and not only counterproductive. It doesn't address the problem of the drug addiction and it doesn't address the problem of poverty and unemployment. And creates this. Not conflict dynamic between a lot of communities and police officers so. You know it's that the do a lot to it there's a lot to the complicity of law enforcement in other incentivized unfortunately they can to see the drug were continuing. And when you look at organizations like the drug enforcement agency. In the head of the drug enforcement agency continues to say that the drug like marijuana is as dangerous and addictive drug like. Like heroin then you know that. You know some some not. Our -- think breakthrough -- come back I'm wanna get some specifics of Byrne grant couldn't get into the rest. We're talking about want everything I reviewed citizens. Tremendously. Interesting and educational documentary. -- how to make money selling drugs. Would've been right so look at document region every one of those should. Watch regardless of how we feel about the drug wars. And no it's not a documentary explaining to you how to make mass of it's a documentary exposes the hypocrisy. And sanity destructiveness. America's drug war and we have. The authors and the man behind the camera Matthew Coke. Matthew Fink who were joining us appreciate very much. Near you mentioned something Byrne grants and and more deceived it's kinda light. What -- found out about a couple moments ago I interviewed via former police chief who away. And the danger and interviewed him that weak -- The feds moved in there was an elderly couple in. Only he is Dennis. Light savings they took in the invested it in the building. And Walton. One of the really told was a legal. -- form. And the Fed's game and that may be illegal stabilized is about federal. They steal it steal it. -- they take it. And -- Celek. And the and I think he -- -- that it skipped 1%. Local police -- Adrian has said. Does that happen around the countries had to bare ring percentages. Yes. And I said to him. Wouldn't that suggest. Better enlists. Law enforcement agency. Can show how they're gonna make cub that big liberal budget hole and they can report. To have. Drugs. Legal. Or even -- in Portugal's case the criminal. It. Is that. It is that in your documentaries that from them. It appears to be -- 100% true and that's why a that's really what it's almost called how to make money selling drugs because it's not. Just the drug dealers were making money off of the illegal drug trade law enforcement that are making money off -- countries as well. And so I encourage your listeners like you mentioned regardless of what side you believe your on. Take a look at the bill that -- in the thrill ride it feel like. More like -- fiction piece that -- nonfiction piece and you can get it on on iTunes. Or Amazon by the dvd up Amazon dvd yet. And you'll see how law enforcement makes money off of the drug war and it's not. Complicated not conspiratorial it's right out there in the open and like you said. With the current forfeiture laws. If -- the laws suspect's view a drug program they can take your property. Your money the vehicle. Even your column for that matter and it's incumbent upon you to prove your innocence. So it's completely -- the idea of guilty until proven in assent on -- And then not only that not only. Horror can you imagine. You know being someone -- -- -- the forfeiture laws when you're in the sense but you're incentivized. As the police department to go after. -- merely it's really racially disproportionate low level drug I mean it's not. In these guys aren't going in taxes Beverly Hills and taking mentions of the blowback would be incredible now they're here. They're doing the opposite there was a judge. A a judge in in in how to make money selling drugs to admit on camera that he is yet over her the police -- say. You know we need another vehicle they'll confiscate one. You know that these guys. You know they've they've literally go out and it's like highway robbery to expect -- one gang rob more powerful and -- another one. And obviously is. You know concerned citizens we don't want to have violent drug -- on the streets and neither do we want our law enforcement. Dependence. You know upon these drug laws to help them finance their departments because what happens at the end of the year if you cleaned up all your drug dealers. Well where you can get the budget for next year you need more drug dealers to qualify for those ingredients. There's no incentive really for the drug war and and so the and in the side effects of this are incredible in the psychological effect on and being a soldier. You know in the war on drugs and here you are having to defend. Psychologically your own actions it's like being you know in a war overseas. That that is not rights. -- that is not. In my opinion that's just not morally or ethically okay to do and ask about our law enforcement. And another sure don't and this -- -- Pinkston me more than anything you. More -- it's in your documentary you heard about it. HSBC bank of think second largest in the world -- out of bidding. And they have huge number of affiliates here in America all over the world. The feds. Went to them on two or three different occasions and says and weakens CU. Laundering. Billions of dollars. Forward drug cartels and terrorist. And warned them to stop it on the second third fourth time and when it was. -- finally moved in and so okay that's who we're gonna make you feel fine. Nobody in there and nobody charts. Nobody prosecute. And then it was revealed there were five on the back to overweight from Wachovia. To credit -- a number of others. In again and do the -- itself was equal to about. Happily warned months revenues. And brought to me the question again and if at the highest levels. Over a monetary system. We're knowingly. Washing money cartels and terrorist. And we have assurances. Number not going to be named Bernard going to be sent to jail again it's and our system just. Ribbon with the with the drug money and the drug industry. Yes and in the that it did so again incident too big to fail mentality. And you know federal and state authorities. You know she's not. It is that you cannot indict because they're afraid of what happens when a large financial institution could potentially be toppled the businesses. You know that is beyond. It's beyond reason. So I mean I think that the amount it was a the fine. That the bank will -- with about one point nine billion dollars and I think it was about. You know is there's some some people say it was two weeks and then comes some of the people that five weeks and income for the -- But imagine. You know you're a small time drug dealer working on the street. And someone that you know we're gonna take a month income from you for your current. That is blatant. Offensive example of the two tiered justice system we have today with regards to the drug war. Where -- cartels. I don't know if you read this part of the story that your listeners might be fascinated to find out the cartels who were actually depositing. Their money in the -- we're making. Constant boxes. -- that the tolerant and through that they could stack beer money in these boxes and then -- the boxes through the teller windows that they get as much cash. You know illegal cash into the bank as they pitted. Moment by moment and in this hearkens back to like Al Capone days as we're eager -- dragging. Us -- -- -- and trying to deposit them. And the fact that they get a slap on the wrist. Is that what happened. To all the millions of Americans -- after the criminal justice system on small drug charges and so. This idea this fundamental idea. That's being propagated today. But federal and state agencies that drug law enforcement organizations are going after the big boys they're going after the -- They don't care about these small dealers that is that out and out lie in -- HSBC story. Proves without a doubt. And and we we talk about the two levels. African American should you reported out here and -- read it many times four times more likely to be arrested. Them points. -- and go home buyers and sellers or primary early what -- and and at least they use to -- it's still true. They went to jail for a long terms for cocaine. And when we got caught we had small terms of powdered cocaine. That's correct now. I mean it really is something that's important. Work for listeners to taken because it's so mind boggling. That the great majority of us don't think in terms of race. We're not racists. And it it it's hard to believe. But the reality is that it not only numerically but proportionally. So blacks and weights -- and sell drugs at roughly similar raids if anything whites use and sell drugs more. That's numerically and proportionally. So how in the world is that possible. That. Black people. Are systematically. Targeted -- for last four times as much of the way percent but for prosecution. And then for no longer. Criminal sentences. So how would this happen well I think we can find out by looking at the very origin of the drug wars in the first place. You know before 19100. All. Drugs were legal they were sold by pharmacists you know cocaine was that common. Drugs in the eighteen hundreds. The French guy who designed the statue of liberty used to drink Coca war. People drink cocaine. Lays -- calls common and he said. If you have more -- -- would have actually made. The statue of liberty hundred feet or so higher because it was just that common thing that everybody was doing in of course Coca-Cola. Came out as the non alcoholic cocaine beverage alternatives. So that's how popular. Cocaine. Now there's certain point. It became also popular to target minorities. Wii is. Drug -- -- there was Nixon and Haldeman what. Well absolutely but that now we're talking about decades later in this. Started around the turn of the century. Worst Matthew holder -- -- again -- go a little break news is listening so intently. At tech for a long -- to overcome and right back. Herbert talked about a documentary -- is used democracy regardless. All of which cited the drug war wrong. Automatic money selling drugs meant you could come right back. Ripping it about an extremely interesting documentary it's called how to make money selling drops. And -- not about -- you make money selling drugs. That's the its satirical side of that but basically what is saying is our. Judicial system law enforcement -- from our political system -- system or it is all about making money selling drugs. And it seems to have just. It triggered virtually everything. Matthew Cooke who's within the rejuvenated her bond in this. Document -- Award is students a couple of talent in this power. How to where you watch you were your document. You can watch it very easily just coincides soon and either buy or rent that need to watch streaming you can also watch it. On Amazon prime or you can by the dvd off of -- and and -- sent directly to your home. Okay. Have you have you. Heard about. These prison corporations are connected to major prison corporations. Sell there are. Their ability to lower State's prison cause something there in towards something states. And a -- of their raw. Their annual report. Where they've sent -- one side to their shareholders. Were little concern about the legalization. Of marijuana. Because we have contracts. With the states. That in most states say. Read -- under twenty your contract. If you guarantee. 80% occupants. And did to need. Maybe I'm missing something but would you guarantee the occupancy and if you don't you pay a fine. You gotta go get warm bodies mostly black and brown. To fill those beds and -- wrong. No you're not run at all witnesses. And so I mean it I don't know what you can. Called evil the continued you know when you senate. The whole thing of the private prison industry in the first places is outrageous but how are you going to incentivized. An entire group of people. To get as many people incarcerated as possible. And that's why it's one of the many reasons why we see this incarceration explosion. Today. With so many people. In the great great majority of people in prison for committing. Nonviolent crimes to think about that. A nonviolent consensual crime drugs. Put some people are indicates how does that help anybody it just tears parents away from their children. It takes people out of their community. You know it's stopped people rate in the middle of the process of trying to get an education. For many people lose their ability you can get an education and wants your talent -- to check that box that you can't get a job. So what are we actually doing for our society. And we take small town or community which is having struggle in terms of employment and jobs and we -- a prisoner. Now we make the situation even worse because now the only jobs are working at the -- So you know if we're an incentive by ourselves so we're gonna say hey. We're gonna we're gonna award each other with more money in more resources for accomplishing something. Shouldn't that thing that we're accomplishing. Before that it. I mean I would love to the the states and organizations rewarded for. A lack of recidivism rates for success in education. For the least number of impoverished people. You know I think those are financial sense is that that would be good for but the way we. The fact that we that private prisons are even legal is I think you know. They talk about the conditions of those prisons I mean if there if there whole existence. Is set to make money. You know people can just imagine on the eve of the interior programs they cut the cut social services they -- rehabilitation. Programs they cut. Health care and -- services. It's the the last place that that we would want to send anybody. If we care about the well being of our most challenged economically and socially in our society it's. It's primitive and cool. Where were taken another break. I'll look Brock in this couple in my princes of -- and serious shows remarkable. It's a documentary called how to make money selling drugs for unmet recoup we -- Matthew -- would that's. And will continue the conversation right up the ducts. We're thinking about a area documentary board -- everything if you -- extraordinary early in pursuing and Foreman of something we should -- watch. Scroll how to make money selling drugs and it's written and directed by Matthew -- Matthews -- -- at this point. -- view. Have have you ever seen. Flawed document recalled drug wars -- rusty -- No I've heard a bit and the effort it's it's Graham. Who let me just -- -- Rupp port 25 things and we're talking. Well we had him on the show personal -- they simply do video he was embedded. In -- of the two major cartels in Mexico for a year. Which I didn't believe could I didn't think that while the video he set those aside from other things in the document -- Where -- one human being eaten by -- line and another win being put inside upside down. And the two gallon about about a Maria. And win a pole again talk too much it's a big issues this really jurors that we know it's who's goodness -- -- -- world. That doesn't make -- cent level drug cartel led you did you -- in in short to the world. You said because they want Georges -- at that -- state police to -- -- they want least National Guard Casilla. And when they go to one of the above. And say we're gonna shipman of him we like to pay you so and so and they say absolutely not infect them and turn you it and then the -- a picture of where there -- why it works were the daughter goes to school. And the whole documentary was a long blue line and the reason I'm mentioned it is. If you if you draw a line between. Prison corporations. That must have prisoners a set amount or their shareholders. International banks that laundered billions of dollars for terrorists and for a police departments to share in revenues and we're in real Tuesday or properties seized. In -- drug boxed. It doesn't it all tied together to where you've got a real lead -- -- in the war on drugs is even -- Yeah absolutely I mean I think that it it's not unreasonable. For many people to believe that the war on drugs is just a cover. Social control. You know the put unprecedented amounts of poor people. And incarcerated. At at levels of the world has never seen. Deserves some kind of explanation. We're tops in the world leader in Louisiana. -- -- the top of the top of the world and in the United -- top of the world so. How you know what what good does this do. I don't see that -- any good at all and we look at the application of the laws in the two tiered justice system because as you described. It's hard to believe that that this is anything for the public good I think that. And we can look at these things conspirator Lee and I think it's it's reasonable to jump to those kind of conclusions I think the things that we can prove. Are good and to show beyond a reasonable doubt the war on drugs does not work but it's counterproductive. And that it it it it's essentially. The management of the poorest members of our society and putting them in prison and meanwhile. You know does -- -- benefiting financially. Both financially the law enforcement organizations as -- just described are benefiting because -- financed by the government and the perpetual. Cycle of incarcerating poor people. Aka the drug world number and they're incentivized by the drug war and benefit financially. From the drug worked through forfeiture laws were vacancies stuff. And meanwhile there's the small percentage of addicts. Who were financing. The drug cartel. So what would happen if we took fifty billion dollars -- the focused on the few million people who really need help with their addiction so let me explain that for a second when you think about. All the people who who do drugs the majority of people who do. Drugs illegal or not. But there's like one -- Of the people who do illegal drugs recreational needs what they do it as painkiller and so forth and so on that they get addicted. That's something happens where they get addicted now some people call of the disease and those people familiar with -- alcoholics anonymous could say that it's a disease. Other people would say that. That these are that these individuals. For one reasoner and other. Have incredible. Discomfort in their life whether it's psychological discomfort or physical pain or whatever it is. Simply the fact of being alive and being the human being on this planet is too tough to deal live without. Some sort of painkiller. So that small group of people. Who needed there who needs something needs some kind of medicine just to get hi. If we wouldn't apply out of fifty billion dollar drug war toward helping. Well we -- collapse this entire system. Instead we don't do that instead in the United States. Rehab it's hard to come by. No one of the only places you can go over the twelve step program. And twelve step programs I've recommended done many many constant reference they don't work for everybody. So it would be very very useful for us to put more resources into. A dictionary search. Into rehabilitation centers. And to remove the stigma. Of the drug dealers being a critical and concerned that the drug -- of the drug users being a criminal. Think of alcoholics being criminals who think of them as people who need help. Hopefully we do. So we consider ourselves to compassionate society and wanna do things that are that are for the greater good. Then we end the war on drugs and we only vote for candidates local. State and federal. Who who -- and the war on drugs. The forum for my prisons that do not believe that marijuana should be. Legal office. When I was saying to them everything I read everything of the -- together. Susan drug cartels make. Or more money from marijuana then in the coming out. And people or killing each other over. And they always say well and is shows in Mexico and that's it RT. The financial side of dropped. Permeates our society. And that for people getting shot and killed his an exaggeration. No I don't think that generation and I would add to the argument for reference. Look we most of us have the same objective. I do not consume drugs. I don't do. I don't smoke marijuana. It's not something that interest me at the same time on the big proponent of marijuana decriminalization. I don't think that marijuana should be in the hands to be sold by drug cartels so we'll have the same objective. When you do the research. And when you find out how the economics. Drugs to work then. You'd be hard pressed to. Draw any other conclusion other than that decriminalization. Makes sense that we can argue the fine points of the policy. How do we -- Portugal proved it. Portugal absolutely proves that their drug use has dropped significantly and I think the thing is is to just get out of the mindset that just because you legalize something doesn't mean you can don't. So that's that's the deal you know we don't sexually transmitted diseases. Are not illegal. That doesn't mean that the government condones sexually transmitted diseases. There other ways to handle things other -- the strong arm of the law. When we look at the debt problem. Drug addiction. We don't need to look at it as a law enforcement problem. If we do we're looking at it in and not only in primitive fashion but the effects are what they are today. By him up and fortunately we run out of time but love to have you back later date. Again tell people were they can find how to make money selling draw stockman. You can find it on iTunes you can buy better -- there you can stream it on Amazon prime or you can order of the dvd. On Amazon and have it delivered directly to your home. They're very intrusive and thank you for -- this is time to hear about this. -- it over a video do you celebrity -- while the -- Do not go away evangelism that with a big ridge.