Well beyond thinking in this league tagged began a couple of days ago while -- grundy and product of watching Oprah and wearing. The report on two sisters that deliberate trial saying hospital virtually the same time and the cost were -- 151000 dollars difference. And they've had a pair of shorts studies on walk. Or prices in this country hospitals and doctors' offices so different. And and to get more details on a different number brutally Broder a number of ports. But this really all through -- give me the -- him permission is called how to bring the approach of health care into the open. We have both Susan denture weather's Robert Wood Johnson Foundation's senior -- policy advisor. Renowned health policy experts who can think -- guitar. So great to be with -- thanks for having. This article but I think you -- and starts all saying that charges prices rates payments. All have different meanings. And little relation to actual cost is that correct and so one. -- utterly true. Actually what happens in health care unlike most other industries or. Goods or services. Is this people come up with something called the list of charge which is really. You can think it at that sort of the opening bid. On the part of any hospital or doctor caddie for what they would. Like to be okay and then the charge. Actually goes to the insurance company for example. Which that the size where they will often because they. They actually have an -- contract. With the hospital situations that stipulates what they actual wheat and so we're at that -- patient you'll and the seeing on your statement of benefit for literature at the age you'll see a charge. Which is what the health care provider one to beat it you'll see what the incher actually did -- And then you'll see what you're share of that Kostis and again that's also dependent on the arrangement with the that your. So it's well there mysterious should be older people. And because you can almost never find out the charge in -- Pena. Often occasion here and out without paying this year bill. That you really no -- Kia until after the until the dollar what you're going to be liable for. So good you can. Shop hospital recalled saying pregnant them and give birth and soon so month. And I'd like to know Hamachi charge for -- Diapers. Etc. It is starting to happen you can do it not -- that out not as you can see exactly which in the church for any particular. Item. But what you can increasingly fine in some parts of the country is hospital posting their -- world charges. Reports say -- -- -- whatever. Or -- actually they're infection deliver. It is it is just beginning to cap that it is not like any the mean ubiquitous. And frequently went patients who do try to find out the -- at a time. They run up against a brick wall they actually will be hole. We cannot tell you what you have to pay for this procedure and -- people -- their I'd venture. -- who had very high deductible. Or co insurance. And who really -- and caught it shouldn't ban chocolate it is impossible for them out. And in -- see you meet with the portable Tehran. So over and bond plans with that and terrorize. -- average family deductibles. Of 60101000. Plus respectively. So they would have been very difficult time finding -- bullets hunting culture and. Yet. And we should emphasize that don't that that's not the average at the Hyatt. The averages lower. But did but it can be depending on your plan you might have a deductible that -- and then of course you really want to know the constant that you wanted to try. -- we take our first break when -- come back. A -- come back and have to -- to me to come to its goal question. It doesn't have to be this way is there's a reason the -- said -- -- Program in place and or the reveal the better way of doing that round the world WI PO. Brigade celebrity AM 053 yeah. We'll bring it about some very interesting disparate -- and pricing for medicine for treatment -- drugs in this country in particular. Hospital insurance companies. Article on looking at Wall Street Journal says how to bring the price of the healthcare in through the open. Where are talking with Susan denser. Robert Wood Johnson Foundation senior -- policy advisor renowned. Health policy expert. Susan give give. Things like charges prices rates and payments all have different meanings. Even Bernard -- doctors are generally clueless. About what the test drugs and and specialists they broke a minute ago that caused the patient. Is is there a better way is that we've done shows on. The the French model the German model of the English mildly and Australia Singapore or their better models out there. Well one important thing to note is that -- -- prices in all over health care are substantially higher then. Repeated every country. If you look at any particular senator procedures whether -- getting in and -- to me get. Delivering a baby inning hip replacement would have yeah. US prices on average can BP chick. That other countries particularly other countries that we like to excel equivalent to our prices are much higher for example the price -- in camp. Sleepy Canadian prairie oral health care are -- GDP devoted to. How it would be about the candidates should. 1213. 14% that's opposed to seventeen. Going on 18%. -- That -- -- an issue for that country. Why are we ancient China prices across the board and I mean for almost every hospital where drugs appropriate deterrent in particular that are. -- that's one issue in the second issue is how -- we get more transparency around -- and can we do. What will -- can do in our in our system which. A hybrid system we have a lot of public lead paint a picture we have a lot of private health insurance we. Private ventures negotiating different races with different positions at different hospitals and you know what can we do to shine -- light. There are lots of private sector companies coming about now to do the one skull cap like hell -- go on their web site and get some help. Find out what. Various aspects of health care cost. You can go to companies like OK OK which will try to tell you that your cocaine would be sent patient in particular. Parts of the country. And and overtime we're seeing more and more insurers try to put that information on the web -- all here's what you share the cost would be. It here enrolled in our health. But we have a long ago to really bring more shine more light on the part that we pay and health care and that more probably figured out. -- we really should be paying the piper at that -- thing or whether we prefer to. Every Thomas drew show spotlighting friends or. There -- other countries France seems to be everything breed the best healthcare system in the world. Doctors that I talk to -- -- of finding good book worth the one that does all the R&D we -- -- surge in development. We're the ones spending all the money to get to all the bells and whistles that -- custom to. It is that a problem and if so how big percentages that a major reason why our cost. Or higher and if that true does that mean we can't bring him down because we do all the search. Well that argument and so bear it in some industries if you look at change pharmaceutical. We're. Development -- research and development costs are high. And the companies have made the argument that they each need to charge. High prices in well off countries particularly our -- in order to have the resources to investors aren't being. Many other countries that have not bought that argument and countries in Europe traditionally are -- lower prices stripper and medications that we are. And meanwhile. Pharmaceutical companies are moving their search to a lot of other country. So where this argument really -- talent in its. It's it's hard -- to understand. What's right about that argument what's wrong about Eric. If we look at other industries for example hospital. That you really know research development component the year. Mean it's not aquariums and getting really nasty new ways of -- hospital at the US that is different from -- reading hospital. So there really isn't any clear reason why hospital it should be so much hired -- then they are in another country. So in many sectors that helped her that RD argument that's just really doesn't hold water ball we're just Ching higher prices. I used the same way that we take so high prices in the -- restructuring because we cat. Where rich country where we're growing GDP growing last year our economy to that health care I think to -- down country it may be we can't. Spent so much money -- health care and that is the answer is that we can't let that we can do about it particularly in terms of the pre. Ho hum this additional bit off subject but it's something that fascinated. Wanna blurb read the books are -- about -- Europe's. Price. Price using medical came about -- -- -- to. Or read about Canada and Australian community of leading ones but every one problem and crystal ball and on this almost accidentally. Every one of them has a huge debt that scroll in other words they -- empathy for what they've got even rants. A target of its three billion or thirty billion and continually grow every year and each and every one of them. Or having to cut back on some services and number of cost because of that. Do you know of medical. System. That works when it comes to. It doesn't constantly increase in debt in cause. Willis is the case that almost every country in the world is. Completely freaked out about pricing constant health care. Are you in Switzerland for example. They're they're desperately afraid that some day. They will devote 16% of gross domestic product health care -- which they see them kind of the tipping point we of course traps that. I -- a long time ago we're more than 70% of GDP on health care good. -- diapers funeral later. -- means you can't just keep running up -- -- and. Well you know you you can't put that an even larger question. Particularly for the United States is. You know the objective it's not compile it helped secure at the objective that really the primary objective that we want -- to have a healthy population. And in the US we note that even -- we spent far away more than any other country per capita. On health care we don't buy a lot of help. With the shelter now ironic. Other countries spend more work on. Social services and social systems. And this year their current domestic product than we do. What we turn to do it under invest in a lot of those areas that we know contribute no overtime. I apologize I'll look up the clock and told LeBron out on. Can we get your back again this is a show we do often -- important and really helped and experts coaches you. -- Are similar -- -- It Polaroid back kid is the thing tack cone up.