Apr 22, 2014|
Garland talks about the two droughts affecting the U.S. and how best to manage the nation's water resources with Mark Davis of Tulane University.
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Is an independent “select committee” necessary in the investigation of Russian hacking & possible collusion with Trump associates? This hours guest: Max Bergmann - Senior Fellow at Center for American Progress Steve Bucci - Director of the Allison Center for Foreign Policy Studies at the Heritage Foundation
Automatically Generated Transcript (may not be 100% accurate)
Welcome back to. All the reading that booing every -- -- record a bit about California and some dude twists and sleeps in the nurseries. And quite frankly thought about doing chose about it. And the practice. And in. The -- for its roots. Nearly half of the country's view fruits nuts and vegetables column problem California. About one. A Bartley and isn't even going to be played -- this year. So it it looks compressors and the question is it looked like in. Affecting our food calls. And also about the -- it's major when it comes to an old border. They're gonna go looking for water news that means that group were detractors had beaten to a third game. Whenever -- do something or water good to approach this from port it is pure film director institute more fruits and well and policy. -- -- -- Professor of welcomed of the show urge you call all. With twentieth. With -- out -- -- -- that instant teleport is this just the sick political. Suited for New York. Now I don't think seven the all of the projections for them. The western -- the United States has called -- to become drier. And even if it where cyclical you have to keep in mind that news that. There are far more people there than there used to be so the demands on water gone nowhere that popped in general and says the and the shift of things that we want our farmers to grow. -- Growing certain crops you know take more water than others and that's one of the things they've been experiencing in in California is that. In recent years have been ships from left ward and crops to more watered and crops. Now -- mean you you run into law import. Editor read them there review it and it. Wolf look for the person is gonna be crucial in two. Calorie a lot of organic. -- blues and roots. End to lower priced debt and take a whole lot more planning. Where we're isn't it where's that gonna happen and looked like it's gonna happen in California in the -- Well I think that's one of the things -- gonna watch for and -- visiting with our own act commissioner frustrating not to long ago it. I think he is very much aware that certain agricultural activities are not only going to shift they are. Here and there are things that we mean that currently grow in the southwest. -- in southeastern part of the United States. In particularly places like. Louisiana. That we may find ourselves you know -- with the opportunity to host. And you're already seeing large you know ships its cattle ranching out parts of Texas. Two. Less dry -- states. And what you see in California right now even if the rains come you know. And that you know five years from now. The -- -- the prospect that he'll have all the farmers in this farm workers there ready to ramp back up again is pretty problematic. Music group one think you always wonder about. When you haven't dropped for the actual. And I think California had a pretty heavy rain in the month through so you know that just watched the topsoil. But a lot of and certainly it -- it helped be it. But you know being the solution to drought is not a range it's. It's Seton brain and now -- it takes. And what we're seeing right now. In shifting precipitation patterns plus higher temperatures -- higher temperatures cause more evaporation. So he is that's what we're seeing in this matchup the west. And at some point the real choices come into what should water be used primarily for. Urban centers with millions and millions of people. Four industries that are the hired GDP. Kind of them returns -- certain agriculture. Or should it be for ecosystem and like in the -- and those are easy questions and up until very recently. There's been enough water. And into new program and he had two large at least that its at all. That's not only art day -- projections are not where we're going to -- more. Are well worth thinking about who's -- there -- two thirds of California is listed in streamed through exceptionally. -- conditions exception bold stroke and -- Greg coming right back. Does that concern you at all do you think there's a possibility so by it might come looking for our war from this that you -- misery root ball. In order to help does California but the -- well. Called comments questions. Two -- 01 -- somebody told Peruvian born in the country 866. -- and zero beats them. You wouldn't think the drought in California the minute where a -- -- but it just made it could be rising food prices it and a lot of states. Or already talking about looking for watery and when the question does that -- -- Report Davis with the senior search Millwood rector of the institute water resources law and policy. Tulane university. Of Maricopa road forward broke I mentioned that I have read that. Two thirds Californians know labeled extreme. To exceptional. In drug addiction is that as bad as the greetings yet groups that -- means they have for a. Well no there there and means you are in some here in facing dire there. And mean it doesn't mean your options. -- and obviously you'll see a bigger toward desalination. Not just her coastal areas decently and ground water. -- the many more conservation. And you'll -- and you know some populations and industries relocate. So it doesn't mean California is going to go let. You know in Israel actually -- a surplus of water because of desalination desalination is expensive. Produces a lot of waste and it is you know one of the things that we haven't. To do on very extensive scale here. And people who tend to think that there water bill should be almost invisible remote because we don't really pay market rates for water. Are gonna have to learn that water is it's. You know it's going to have a cut costs in the future that we not seeing. There's no question it is going to be you know you know not only California that. Other southwestern states are certainly going to be looking for new water supplies and you know the squabbles between and among states. He is not news. And that's certainly happening right now and in the waters at Louisiana depends on whether it's the red river this being earned in Mississippi River. Are in play. And so we campus. The waters that were receiving today at the waters were going to receive tomorrow we need to make efforts to plant that. And that even in that -- for the first time I've seen. A man who can actually you know have a -- it develops. What would be water. And a set of laws that would begin to really. You know manage and protect you know the control water. In releasing -- So you have somebody for telling your neighbors like entity. We have a lot lonely again but as well. You know it is for at least in in that regard it means and mentioned there are certain industries. That. And certain businesses. That are going to you need more dependable supply of water and that's something that comparatively speaking at least in -- stage. So if we're Smart. And you know the issue is not merely in the Louisiana or must police units and its war where there are thirsty people -- to businesses. It's -- do we want to use this you know what with our first in May be your last great you know natural resource advantage. He's attract those conferences. Investment and that kind of population. That's the Great Lakes states to try to do. And I think you'll see that elsewhere. That. And anyway it's an Alabama border having -- conversation with George. So I -- think that it's time for the week and it's not beauty staying it is uh oh that's happening in California. It means nothing. -- would mean a lot. You know the real question is in do we want you use these things. You know to our to our greatest advantage. If sooner or later water means to where they used to greatest demand Ford and the ability to pay. -- a butchered the news. Those are the road war sources or in play. Absolutely I mean. -- Well I mean. There was litigation between. Are Oklahoma and -- at Texas Supreme Court last year but should be over the red. A river that is very important that we can test over. What and how far Texans can go into neighboring states to take water. And you know I don't think -- -- should forget that was you know in 1968. Texas. Under the -- governor John -- Recognize the Texas who's gonna need to import watered continue to grow and the only place he can envision ultimately getting it -- Mississippi River. In very large quantity. Now. They concluded that the time that we didn't necessarily have -- And that's really -- folks like your friend woody -- you know and -- started really doing the research to prove. That coastal Louisiana you know -- Collapsing in part because we were using -- resources very well. Then need in Texas net needing now Oklahoman that needing New Mexico -- and that hasn't gone away and they are looking at. You know being Missouri River system. The red river system Arkansas River all the tributaries and ground water flows that we depend upon. Those things are already being looked at studied and -- sentences already -- -- You've got so little light. T. Boone Pickens by water rights for -- -- -- and I we're for a. Well whoever -- and you know ground water rights in those states including Louisiana very different. And you know Louisiana and Texas. Both shared heritage is treating ground waters being freely available to whoever you know can stick -- on the ground and pump it out. If I had that I would put well in in anywhere in the least you know -- Texas and currently -- -- gas well. I have to pay -- severance tax. Our royalty to the state and a privilege. I would have to water I can take as much as I want and I can drain my neighbors well and that's not a problem. At least not for me maybe from the neighbor. And I don't have to pay the state in the things for the and that's -- you know folks have been taken -- are doing and there's no particular reason to expect that it will be coming to Louisiana. Means the only reason you haven't seen -- that is you know the cost of living under great distances is pretty expensive bit. -- do -- look at oil and gas pipeline system to realize it. At some point it makes sense and at some point it gets done. There is a legislature. Doing anything about that remember reading. Canadian river authority actually went to the T. Boone Pickens the it's been over a hundred million dollars to boil water rights. Well Louisiana do not think this is a Smart thing and is that. You know they've begun the last two four years to really start looking at well. Who can use our waters you know what can you use them for. And where should you be able to use. And -- some that was you know prompted by nontraditional uses like tracking some that was produced by. Nontraditional efforts like on the sitting river to sell surface water rights to water merchant. Folks who wouldn't turn and so water Texans and whomever else want to -- And but the -- -- in the industry asking. You know the Louisiana State -- institute and the police and a lot of resource commission to. Take a look at Louisiana water titled what it it tells what it might need to be. And is that again -- -- -- and lead in the legislature right now that would ask. The Louisiana State law institute to be begins the process of drafting quote -- water code. Most other states have something like that. That. Believe that for example does not our -- you know Louisiana -- on science and hydrology are completely and connect yeah. You know ground water flows can be the same circus water flows and vice Versa and any person -- persistence. That we treat him the other ones on the new ones that are they're completely different and and we tend to view -- -- it is always if anything we have so much of -- and it's always -- -- convenience. We're now starting to recognize that water is even here. You know there are scarcity issues particularly with respect to. You know our neighbors and one of fundamental questions is should we be supplying water to him like we supplied. Full for oil gas timber workers and anything else or should we be using water primarily. To shore up our you know sustainability of natural heritage. And only Democrat in the huddle getting more more intrusive more more complicated -- can it keep you for ten more -- Yes -- can go yeah. Yes that would go to didn't what the president and the governor but I mechanical. Expected to. -- -- -- -- -- -- -- You have to water -- troops law and policy. Thought about it trial in California in the Midwest League but many of effective option in good ways and bed come right. Just a few more minutes -- board did -- search fellow director of the institute water resources law and policy. Tulane University. More -- when it comes to. The drought in California to drought in the midwest and as you said everybody is going to be looking for. I know off and and wars the war. One of controversies concerning fracking which means part of the two weeks ago. He is the use of boom -- that some boats water and due to those two -- Yes they do it and if I mean that is the real reason you know. In Louisiana in and urged the you know cracking. Industry get out of ground water in two. You surface water and they had to create certain short term. Authorities for -- to -- So there's no question you know any time you are bringing in new water users to the party. It you know it has an effect and we also have to remember that really until -- fifteen years ago. -- water was largely for drinking you know. You know used in industrial prophecies are the cooling agent for the most part. And a screen -- gauge. But you know -- would biofuels. And tracking we've now made. You know the energy industry far more water dependent. And while it's possible to track with things other than. You know fresh water and Clinton in fact you can do without water well but it costs more. And those are the kinds of things I think you know we -- to be mindful of every time -- you know at any straw to the current milk shake there's you know. People but not everybody gets as much as they used him. One of my -- comprised. Decades ago that area camera promote them. Minnesota in the where the Mississippi actually begins. And we led a team moved to a timbers and water experts and we were gonna test the drinking water. From the river next to deal millions so good and noble and they're -- sound studio in the river. And too much of Prague what we've found out aside from -- Minneapolis. And Dallas. Everybody else is on the corporate. So if if of the Hubble you've brought over. Dates in the midwest and California putting straw into the rivers to beat Louisiana. Or we gonna have to lead the reason. Gonna be in everybody's best interest on the river have part of that. Well I think it's going to be happy about it because first ball a lot of the -- -- plain. Mean that's certainly true and you get that into you know. But I you know the high plains which is you know where we go lots that we can Paramount according these days but that's almost all of you know irrigation. Based. Agriculture and that's mostly ground water that is plain out it's not renew. And then you come in down the effort to places like campus and certainly admiration outrage is having its own issues with salt water moving into that awkward. First that it depends upon. And one of the things it has been in him. Loudly discussed and debated in that rages whether large industrial users. Such as you know you know Exxon refinery should be using essentially the drinking water supply. Whether that should -- to the river in Arkansas has had this conversation is that they've nipped in to more aggressive war planning in the last decade or so. And it's made a significant difference in the top of the rock -- But now we're we're going to be we'd have to I think be. Leading voice and because. Being in many ways war policy. Hand -- you know water stewardship. River system like this is built from the bottom. Mean if you don't have a bottom at the Mississippi River does not work. You know. Himself to Baton Rouge for navigation population's support industrial support and maintain in ecosystems provide so many benefits. And quite frankly it's not serving the nation. But as well as the -- assumes that we're happy -- things are in the we're gonna let it continue. And you shouldn't. Expect them to -- come looking. You know what might be in the best interest. One vital question. Either if you had to look overall. Louisiana with the changes coming. Where the oil shortages in the midwest and western part of the country. Plus or months. Well from the Arctic Wear on I'd say it's in it's. We're not panic Goodwin because people that we have you know I think plans could make a difference I don't see this movie on this plants aggressively enough. Upon looking at options quite frankly I think options for Louisiana and in particular places like Newark -- -- you know. In a brighter than I can say they are from any other large and a large areas urban areas in the United States and internationally. We know we have the ability to show up to a point you know people in between in the Gulf of Mexico we have a large. Fairly dependable supply of fresh water. We do not have -- opinion on such a huge population that we can't Serbia. And in fact we have reason to grow keep in mind that even the city of New Orleans proper once was home to almost twice the number of people who appear now. And that's you know those -- the kinds of things that I would say that if we. You know really decide we want to invest in our future and I think we can have a bright -- But. At this point it's more a question of whether we're willing to act on that that opportunity in time for to matter. Mark Davis always have played over -- on the -- we got -- and -- important issue. We're going to be called -- a whole lot moral and we can get Carolyn thank you put this it is -- pleasure -- lord David Singh -- urged fellow and director of the institute war reached rooms as law and policy. At Tulane University would be.