WWL>Topics>>4-30-14 10:10am Garland: on search & seizure of cell phones

4-30-14 10:10am Garland: on search & seizure of cell phones

Apr 30, 2014|

Garland talks about whether police should be able to search the cell phones of individuals they arrest with Nicole Flatow of Think Progress Justice and Hanni Sakhoury of the Electronic Frontier Foundation.

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Automatically Generated Transcript (may not be 100% accurate)

Welcome back busy do in the doping -- today. And a doctor in California and senator Barbara. Britain and opted p.'s chief of security in the -- for journal. -- going viral and in particular medical records fees to doctors are damned tired of mandated -- requirement from bureaucrat. And they're not gonna take it anymore. Urging other doctors not to take any insurance or Medicare. Reports changes that benefit doctors and patients. So we'll talk to. A couple of medical representatives. To find out. Is is this. A law that occupies a lot of doctors how big -- problem is that more importantly or there in the ventures. Also longing to will be looking at medical marijuana. -- Leo long arms reduction should being debated today in the legislature. Well about doctor -- group -- with the Emmy award winning chief medical correspondent. Help medical and will -- -- Ian and and bolstered talked remember the Cato institute on this subject sell or talk about something a little bit different Supreme Court. Is debating. In warrantless cell phone surgeons. And about memory certainly bright promoter radler 201 gentleman California. Stopped by the police say service's own connected to him to a gang membership and arrested him. No one in Boston. God straw. That inserts his cell phone. So all a residents number. Attracted back in their own contraband here and arrested him. I think both of these cases have ended up for the Supreme Court as to whether or not this is legal. Four on the stop without war and in the please check yourself. Veteran says it will which turned to be experts Nicole plateau -- this. Think progress and justice Nicole welcome sure appreciated star. -- lucrative but I think -- with the Fourth Amendment it is. Protections against quote on reasonable searches and seizures him right there. Earlier. That it is now about -- four men and it department and and it that you're currently include GP protected from -- and Peter and then there are exceptions to those roll right so what are. Talking about here is how broad exception aren't allowed police and get your -- a bit. Come and indignant that part of the deal right in the pondered where quite concerned about the ability of the government and lot or any Qiyue. Turn it go and she's individual personal business -- -- and the cat brought forward application web attack in. Concert fishing expedition looking for things that people -- on -- -- an open course. The California's solicitor general one of them presenting his argument to court. So that cellphone should be treated no different from the cigarette panic or address book seized from suspects pocket and they. Drawing in -- suspect into their pockets that same thing is say let me see what's in pro. I mean they -- a lot of that classic eight bit of technology Ali really changing that nature what are called me so. Greg and -- a lot of different conclusion did you practices before it in court because what happened out attack. In the rule and police are required to get a bar before it can search -- and the idea of that is that. Explain what exactly they searched and what are you working course that they can't go on mr. -- expedition and but when that. But Allah or whatnot that being at the architect now -- carry your pocket. -- Very good -- that rule that earth did they do need that more and more. Ready and that it -- -- it and did you contact the -- they're taking a gun. And intended to heat index could be sure that featured an actor and hack on you rate cut out. That -- and certainly people have been cocaine in her pocket people having forgotten now everybody -- -- are -- their great. The idea is complete and in that get pulled over -- tactics app and are actually need her in her. Traffic. Something pretty minor currently yet decided -- actually guilty taking out search your entire. Bright and that they're into the circuit and that that you can take people. When they were and that it's quite a bit. More information in there and other places where police are typically not -- -- about it more but at your house. All right well let me take a break here this is good very complicated and to me. Regardless of which side you're on its. -- moves can -- king Solomon moved. To figure out where the line is that that protects his with the Fourth Amendment. But also for Texas with -- police protection. Let's do we give -- a bit more clear when we come back of common share of questions this is important all of those Gibbs call 260187. -- but there is Supreme Court today added their debating whether monopolies. Without Warren can stop you for something else go through your cell phone buying something that. Connotes criminal activity or suspicion there of and Russia. Happened to 01 person in Boston no person -- or new orders took that. Through -- -- State's records and now it's in these supreme court of the justices is trying to decide. Howland and new news about what's good idea with the we have Nicole plateau where this and progress justice in the -- funeral model and bring you more liberal listeners. Built in mid city appreciate the call. They are a call -- thought or question for your figure -- their outlook. I understand are accurate and I agree that. Circumstances are. We -- these search and -- a little more used to the war. It permits and my question comes at a -- the caller. Call it all out someone or narcotics. RR RR arm like that. And -- Obviously they get that I don't -- it goes and pretty calm. Which gives you all vote and award sport. First of all and it's a question -- what. We are person between your repertoire and talking about all -- so commit a violent. -- -- -- -- Like what you. Saw in particular I. Expect that triple repair. The destruction of preparing our crime occurring in the immediate future. Sure there aren't accurate and the second part of your question that let's start with the first -- -- are coming in. Question -- Absolutely that it. That line. At their all you want -- paint market you can hold their own audio and give it more and that actually demeaned. Alternate in that being discussed in the gap me and -- you are challenging the warrantless search of people spoke on ones that are -- in -- yet that. You can call -- all in and eating its employees and technological measures that are available to prevent that phone from being liked it better like that. Where you while you. Go get more what you might not only tell you whether rejected an apartment unit surged at all. But also get there are other actors tactic again when you are out there right checkbook or particular that are -- into -- -- and not anything that. One of content that it would it'd be called followed. I wonder what it yet but I don't know how particularly at our protector in the app and the -- recruited -- -- well well. You went -- -- -- answer the second part of your question what life. I. -- Them. Pocket chart reports. -- that maybe. Vote from your. -- ball ball. Which at -- pitching to. Contact once tutored on it. All or simply to -- out. What. Their. -- Or. Art or art corporate structure that all ought to. Tell. Question and good actor -- which is. There it certainly. Without my getting Nick -- you on -- that that there would be pretty eat that he thinks he's making her collar text -- you that would imperil your situation right that you would he have fun and I've -- my teacher by the -- and why you need to immediately start a calculator or expect that that. -- It. Because. Why. Are. There. Up are. Now back -- -- -- -- -- Or draw or get it out. -- Sure that the port. Call that could be going up. -- -- Amy and it did act and at other. At. -- you know I mean -- Certainly -- -- and their perspective why would be your interest. Back and beyond what they're actually now for search and interact in which is that your. Didn't like security at that on their pertinent but they're going to accept going to enable and -- and destroy it out right that you're going to use the occasion that and that obviously using Alan and other way right at the drugs in his pocket. I I don't. -- -- -- such. Let it. Go home and I. Urge all or. -- -- -- -- Check it out on. A bit -- -- -- okay coffee table when I get the circle out. -- -- -- The award -- for -- -- should it back there it would coupled with Apollo. Well still. Once again yet. It would be -- And how -- urged their own back. They expected a lot about current and all that extra drugs in which case. They're nineteen and -- entry to go inside the drug war but debt buildup like it and call it it -- -- yet there was in the -- and you made. Well -- -- that it would buy that Ernie and that would be sharing drug culture that you know about anger surged. The -- I think you'd get dairy. It in here but. There are a lot of did it in -- it might be a key probably indicate the better word immigrant out. Where he'd heard about you would find -- -- and it that would. It human -- in your -- you outline or. -- without urgent call and that probably making it begins -- are going to Mangini. Options and there are a lot and talking about here in between. And herbal and the third -- and we're currently. In the -- here. And out of the of the please poured into it brought up Puerto or the justices. Considering. In the -- of his questions. Figured instant that needs talking about weird. Acts someone about the destruction of evidence out there because they -- a -- -- -- -- question. But certainly one thing they did it got quite a bit. You know leading to a -- In that there are a lot of -- -- type of information on a patent that indicate that and there are some Arnie can't. -- indicate that eighty something there searchable and then two instances. And not and other. You know in the -- apparently it didn't take into account for apple. It might be -- On an individual -- can't -- Peter emailed -- -- search history -- might be the -- that they take a look at your column. But other earnings and on the pole race. So I think -- part about it they -- part about the fact that. Not all crack -- -- been need -- it can be distinction among -- all right now that at this point it out you could hear it. In nature not wearing seat belt and that would -- police in -- party. And it being corrected for. A violent crack right and it maybe it means that there are done. Allegation that more and more. Expensive circuit that the alone and others and that and other. Consideration accurately check. He problem whenever you would talk to police law enforcement politicians. Government leaders. Whenever you get in the complicated subjects like it is Yule was students a lot of talent right and so. We better be careful changing is because it's a slippery slope. Rating the last night to and as sage on the via. Records have been recently revealed. They were analyzing would face recognition -- -- known terrorist looking for footage showed people they suspected of terrorism. Would troops to guard college everybody would be in favor that. -- the -- meantime so called accidentally. It was called the Pentagon's optic nerve program. Brooke -- recorded webcam sex. By unknown by its unknown targets. Up to about 21% of the material collected. Was undesirable sex and nudity. Employers warned not to access according to the documents. And remembering that I am. This thing so complicated. That do we get to a point where somebody gets pulled over important not wearing seat belt. Policeman sees the tax on the phone that it's. Destroy in my stead should and I see you see we're going it just seemed like. Jaywalking. They addicted take phone and looked. Yet. And that ultimately partially -- on an -- and what is that they're going to be argument that a lot where it had more -- -- mr. marketing. Secret detentions the you are positive result in an island in Hamburg and it is that comes at a price for it and the question it. Regular price were willing to eat that straight and one at that -- either under the in need protect certain private individuals should be free. Unlimited -- -- -- and that's what we're talking about here and you're completely right at -- area separate that situation there could be affecting. How that ruling could be -- an air and army in its acceptable lot of art and governing. That means are about equal because that day right now. It out and out that there is authorized T picture conference into an era he had that in fact that your colon. Hurricane locking your -- you get anything else. You know and -- Not knowing how the weather pattern -- -- any conviction injury and you know whether it be dropped in next day. What erected and access to call. Well -- -- army and -- someone that information might be valid there on the other information may be and being. -- being. Tripper you're under under. Miracle Berry Berry Berry complicated it's off I'm sure will be doing a shorter -- love to have your bike and later on thank you for the top. It. Rory coming up next we'll talk to -- staff attorney with the electorate. Frontier foundation. -- but bill brigades but he -- five the Rio. Or -- -- my -- education. In the world of technology. Seems cut way back when in this country was first form and we develop something called Fourth Amendment that. Protected us against quote unreasonable searches and seizures but that was will be able for the complicated world of technology. Today at his record is debating on whether or not leagues without warrants and search our cell phones. When they stop us. We have honey -- you -- staff attorney with the electronic frontier foundation. On -- welcomed it sure appreciate it off. So what's your take on there as soon as this I mean if -- complicated on one side. You look at the police saw tendency sure you know they do this through their own protection they're protecting odds. They're they're I've certainly seen. Debates by federal law enforcement the bombs can be so at all with cell phones and so forth and so on on the other side. Are we heading to a position where roi. We can ever policies for -- currency. Well you know that's really that tension that and all of these cases and and even be on the the civic issues that the food -- here is how we apply the old -- commitment principles to modern technology and so in the -- after. After the site. You know. Four for the electronic frontier foundation my organization we believe that the police should not be allowed to search so incident to -- people carry too much sensitive and important information. On their boat and so a lot of police to be able searched or did you buy virtual arresting someone for driving under the influence alcohol or. Any minor and for it at any you're the bad. Is is unreasonable. We -- -- -- -- -- so purported to be a policeman. And hit a couple of example and questions. Words should shouldn't police if they -- somebody. In the car of four of their grocery speeding. And Dave BC detects that says there -- destroy the evidence and -- to Boston. Something like that. They say -- -- shouldn't police be allowed to put the so the phone aside. Take could doom and within the headquarters get a war -- and then take a look at the. Well. Absolutely. And not really in dispute there's no question that when the police arrest someone. He can't take that your take control itself. But the real issue is one -- taking control and cut -- -- the what are the police lab to do and they surged in the entire. Or not and again our position is that they should not -- the search of the but they can ultimately keep on. And probable cause. And you know make Schilling to the magistrate who had been China's search warrant to allow the police search well but the problem is. If we start with the default position is that the police can search. You're regardless of what they've seen regardless of what they've arrested the person for. Opening are all its Sudbury area potential review. I think it was justice deluge yesterday's super bluntly. Anybody's doctors suspected. During the inning on the encrypted cell phone and does so with their own -- Well I I I don't know about that. I think what you're alluding to was traditionally in the -- Went with the court's first started talking about that's right of the police to search a person incident who -- It was it was talking about that in a series that -- from the 1960s and seventy. And at that time you know that maybe it should you choose the -- that if you get arrested. The police are going to be able to look after your wallet will be able to look through your purse or backpack -- -- wrong -- cheer you on you like your first. But the issue that that traditional physical world limitations. Really limited that search so even though the police to look in your wallet for example you. A few cancel -- that caper picture you -- -- your -- like. But all in tire -- out all your pictures all while all your -- And that that much more broad search that has traditionally been a laugh out -- I don't think people shouldn't read that. -- may just go out in public and in 08 get arrested for whatever. Police looked through every. -- it's arrested in public. There's not surrendered expectation of privacy in their own or if the police arrest someone for speeding or texting while driving -- Or are murder you would expect that the police would not just go right. Are there correct person -- -- out instead it would go search warrant to search and how it should be aiming artful little. -- little cigarette break here we'll come right back Kobe -- listeners have questions for him if you're just Jordan does. We're having your. A future shock conversations. What I call it technology. Is is literally moving at Moore's law in an all slew exponentially. And the more -- we do like this. The more I begin to wonder. It's technology moving faster. Then we can change. Not just through to keep up with the understanding that. But people -- that in a or actions that -- social mores and rules what do you think two's exit row. 187. Well according to religious pure roots search. 9%. Of Americans have cellphones at the 8% of us have Smartphones. That's why the debate brought -- stream court right now is so important they're debating whether. Police stood stock pros can take a look at our cell phones if there were suspicious. Of doing something wrong with a war. We have skew their little -- -- a bureau president John -- opinion poll. Of would you be for against it's eighty players 86%. Of you say against. We have colonies -- would -- its it's that turn the electric frontier foundation. And to bring in some of the listeners brutal Laporte wrong with ought. That problem and patriotism is to really -- to you about it -- -- not properly done -- 26. You know I'm not all why not in my business at the BAA -- -- but now. Somebody. Didn't call me. All I. -- -- is being well they're the only days. -- my record is you call them up and ignoring. Yes marijuana in the U -- They don't about it -- topic. Common and allocate it like dominos and they'd be -- -- February and about that. Yeah I have been I think in a lot of places that's absolutely true but what we're debating here. Is not so much has been bringing in drugs do you via the -- is whether. The police thought Puhn regardless whether you have -- them on your opponent should be able to look at it 50%. Of those that have the Smartphones. Most of those Smartphones have most of bureau or your wife. In that phone from photographs to GPS. Records of where you've been we've talked to. Photographs. Scripts you know -- Only one and look at all of this. One of the things that policeman that called -- -- I think -- -- mentioned boards. You know the go and you'll hold me in the huge pile of cocaine you know in the coffee table in the living room bail lockdown how's the goal get Warren in the comeback act. And they're searching for that cocaine and more cocaine. But they go through everything ignorant to draw hours ago through kitchen cabinet agreed through everything. Once they get -- war aren't they should be able to do the same thing with the -- new thing. To a certain extent yes once they get the wars that allows them to searched on the warrant of course -- What's called particular which is basically limited to only those places where and he knows they're going to wind and evidence that they want. And there's -- another very you know interesting debate about how to apply that principle to electronic search it. But in your and your hypothetical about the cocaine for example. You know in that scenario the police had seen something clearly in the air line of sight that is contraband. They have clearly you know -- all will cause the surged. They can then look for you know drug evidence and places were likely to see. The problem with the shall search you really think about it he would. In this specific issue the quarter looking out there talking about seeking your opponent looking -- regardless of what they'd seen and regardless of what you've done. Simply because you've been arrested for some. So for example JJ -- He could get arrested. Not likely but could theoretically. Become -- the -- Virginia -- -- need to get more evidence of that back QJ -- -- the opposite side. Probably in the -- just argue and yet that court the the search -- that Matt. Is cell phone search our person is arrested for driving without a seat belt and that has actually happened in agony out -- so on search and and that's. Very problematic are. If a phone is locked. Could you -- had a couple -- it's that we need to shall walk through phone. Your -- is locked and they get a war that they can save you to unlock your phone right. Well because. QQ and -- if you choose to say yeah sure -- -- and then you know that's -- new. If you say no well at ten inches staying you know and another interesting legal issue which is whether you -- to unlock the phone for. Entry you know we Fifth Amendment right to not incriminate art of the -- there -- just means speaking word difficult I mean. Doing an act that Peru's. That at that particular thing belongs EU. And so that's an area that could trigger some other problem in terms that you know you're -- amendment privilege against self incrimination. But ultimately you know you know -- work locker per share lotteries the security here but why. That made in India or a police search for. Mean they can't search ultimately go to make a lot of technical obstacle that searching. Obviously good news this is that tests of the relevance of legal doctrines. Developed in the the free digital age. Hmmm is it is there any chance regardless what the Supreme Court. Determined that legislators. Or congress will have to pass new -- I think they'll mean -- an attempt by some say the law that would prohibit the bleached during. I'm California for example that trying to. The legislature passed a law that would prohibit the police are searching the cell phone incident to rest. But the governor vetoed the bill and there are others state that basically try to use similar things but generally when it comes to. Protecting our privacy and you know all these new digital devices -- -- you know you age. Under the there or -- for legislatures and congress. The play and and many of them are doing the other forms of electronic at an electronic incur. It's a brave new world 3300 to we'll do Paula to in this hopefully we can get you back thank you for the time. It. Governor I backed Garland -- of Woodward called and turning double a mobile brigade 7080 -- 53 yeah. All right you don't forget and get ready debut -- 1000 dollars in our vacation contest or bill at least the chance at. I'll give -- code words stay with.