WWL>Topics>>6-27-14 10:10am Don Dubuc: on the upcoming Nagin sentencing

6-27-14 10:10am Don Dubuc: on the upcoming Nagin sentencing

Jun 27, 2014|

Don Dubuc fills in for Garland and talks with WWL legal analyst Chick Foret about what to expect from former mayor Ray Nagin's upcoming sentencing.

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Automatically Generated Transcript (may not be 100% accurate)

And on Fridays it's gone down to -- with you filling in for all -- Robinette this morning we're broadcasting from Covington Louisiana this side of the emergency operations center for saint Tammany parish along with me is Dominic -- In our cubby hole here with in we've become embedded during times of are McCain's tropical storms depressions or other emergencies for saint Tammany parish we -- the official. Emergency broadcast station in the -- -- in official emergency studio also welcome aboard. If that works out pretty well because as many of you know on the last Friday of each month pat Christen saint Tammany parish president Georges saint Tammany parish update. Lots of things happening in and around saint Tammany parish will be joined -- on the 11 o'clock hour. And we'll open the telephone lines up you content and if you have any comments questions and she'll let us know what the latest goings on here. In addition to that immediately following a missed presses and you'll talk to Dexter Ricardo mixers and the rector of saint Tammany parish. Homeland security and this emergency operations center and if you -- saint Tammany parish resident and even those of you who live to the south of saint Tammany parish and you may be traveling through -- have plans for evacuations. In round through to this past. -- he'll be able to tell you the latest here and also would give you some information about being contacted and would contact where two ago. If you need shelter those types of things is we are unfortunately in. Hurricane season hopefully the el Nino is gonna make this very quiet season. With with el -- we get the west wind we will more rain it's not the greatest fisherman but. Certainly is a better conditions for keeping those storms out of my area. Are also coming up a little bit later on in the 12 o'clock hour. I unfortunately was involved in an incident here in saint Tammany parish in fact that my home. It was an attempted carjacking. Event that took place. It successfully. Defended myself and the tobacco the potential attack it was eventually. And cuffed and taken to jail he was arrested on outstanding warrants at some Pryor's. A lot of compliments go out to the saint Tammany parish deputies who responded. Also to a deputy George on that made them available to us that you will get to hear this later on. A copy of the 911 tape that I made which in an incident that started out as a humanitarian. Gesture on my part that ended up in basically emergency call for assistance so you'll get to hear that and it'll open up discussion again on Second Amendment Rights why it's needed -- why you we need to preserve and protect those rights. If you live in today's world that's going to be coming up a little bit later on. This hour we welcome aboard a familiar voice on WWL radio and beat them you'll television. Chick -- joins us to talk about. The sentencing it's coming up for a ex mayor Ray Nagin of New Orleans he has been. Convicted. Tried sentencing to come on July 9. And it. Between. The time he was convicted in between the time he's going to be sentenced by judge in generic in. There's been some letters sent in requesting leniency. For various reasons and just to get an idea of what we might expect as far as the impact of those letters in what latitude. In American as -- what those charges could bring in terms of jail time and sentencing we have -- for an expected Jones to talk about it chip welcome aboard sanctioning witnesses or an hour on very good. Check out let's start off with. According all the convictions on all the charges he has what is the maximum amount of time in punishment that he could get very. Well done he was convicted twentieth 21 counts in the indictment the jury came back with guilty -- twenty of the 21. We spent a great deal of time talking about that the one count but it was found not guilty. Really involve his -- not so much you know but what you have to look at what the judge will look at -- -- in in this case -- look at the federal sentencing guideline. And those have been calculated in a very expensive presents investigation report that was prepared by the US Probation Department now. The general public does not get to see that I have not seen net. But I have on over the guidelines my my different data course they'll. He's a warrior and I shared space -- -- -- we over the guidelines yesterday and we have calculated that -- -- -- -- 36. And that his sentencing will be somewhere between fifteen to thirteen two -- years in nineteen and a half years. And the way the federal sentencing got want to work it's almost like you do when you tax. And you can have three different CPA do your taxes and you're gonna get. You're gonna get different results a few dollar off the way but essentially gonna get more or less the same results as to what taxi heroes. And non federal sentencing guidelines do you take out more just like you would do it attacked as a -- 44 and you figure out okay. Now what was my income and and Indians this situation would be what what the criminal activities. And for your hard court listeners if they go both federal sentencing guidelines and they go to to concede one point one. They'll see the chart. And you level sports talk at all levels would -- because it was a public officials. We get to wobbles the president Bob -- one product. We at war more levels because he was elected official. We had fourteen more levels because it was between 400000 and a million dollars that is the improbable loss. The amount of the activity that criminal activity that took place we had another level because he was an organizer. And I bring this to a level 36 which is 188. To 235. Months. So if you calculate the federal sentencing guidelines Jeff -- in in my opinion. Will be presented with a report and the calculation. Where he should be sentenced. Between fifteen and in nineteen and -- fifteenth two -- nineteen here's an interesting. Factors which may be developed by the government is that there's also a provision on the federal sentencing guidelines. Which says that you can add to levels just -- into it at two levels. Because he testified. And should make lines that he gave perjured testimony that he committed perjury because when you look at his testimony is testimony was contradicted. By meaning. Other witnesses. If in fact she gives him those additional two levels -- -- and -- nineteen and. To 24 years we all know the federal sentencing guidelines are advisory. They used to be mandatory law which changed their advisory she doesn't happen. The follow what. What should it's the more conservative wobble of fifteen and nineteen years. That is what judge spared in will be looking if you ask about the -- global letters make it there. I have found on in my experience over the last 35 years. That the -- make a difference if the judge has not had much interaction with the defense. Internal situation in the dependable go in the plea -- the and that will be the only interaction that the judge will have with the defendant be the only time he or she being project really it's perceived that defense. In this situation and in that situation out the back to that situation where you're sheep the judge's only -- one interaction with the defendant. They don't really know much about the -- and it will get this very expensive professionally written report from the Probation Department. It will say all the good things all the bad things about the defended the letters will point out the good things and I've found that the judge. In those type of situations. May latch on to whatever good stuff is contained in the latter. In this situation that is totally different from -- Ray Nagin testified for a couple of days -- Barrett got to see him in the courtroom for weeks. I don't think the letters in this case I'm gonna make much of their. Well now when you say she has to work with in the -- galaxy does not could she go below the fifteen and Harold -- and ninety you can pretty much -- what -- want. They are advisory they're not mandatory. Usual situation I mean you know if if there will put Vegas was put a line up they -- -- lineup between you know fifteen and two thirds and in nineteen and I have. Which you battle look at other senses look at Sapient port saint Pierre who was the charged in the same the same case -- -- not the same number. But the same conspiracy. He got seventeen and a -- I I I think that the government will make the argument judge. CPA -- at seventeen and -- have years he was just the contractor. Ray Nagin what the mayor of the city it will that the time course awarding these contracts according to what the jury found. The fact that the jury box popped and you give Ray Nagin last. Then the contract the guy you need to give him more. Then seventeen and I anticipate that an argument that the government gonna make I also think the government can argue for the addition to levels for the perjury. Because all of us who watched Ray Nagin testified. That was the disaster. -- lot of witnesses testify a lot of defendants testified he was one of the worse. And she may well and almost two levels. We'll have to wait -- -- -- -- OK yet the government. He is not and it shall in any mercy the government is gonna put their foot down his throat and try to jump on it it's as much as they can. Because of the fact that the I hate this -- is what made them go to trial in need them put all of their evidence on he made them. Present their -- and I think the government will take the position. If you wanna see our case you will see you saw the jury rendered its verdict and network wants for the maximum time. -- talking with chick foray we're gonna take a quick break and we come back -- wanna talk about. What happens is from an appeal standpoint for me aside from the government from the defendant's attorney. If in fact she goes outside of that is there's something -- at the final word and also what about his attitude. How much did that have all will that play into the sentencing there's been no remorse has been no apology has been no admission of guilt. Will that play into the cents will be right back with Jim Moret you listening to the think tank on the big gates avenue live from the cover an emergency operations center in saint Tammany pair. And welcome back him up broadcast today from Covington the saint Tammany parish emergency operations senator -- you -- for Garland Robinette chick foray is on the line with this with talking about the sentencing date of July 9 coming up for. Ex mayor Ray Nagin we've been told the federal guidelines according to the of the comments that are put out could result in. Fifteen in two thirds years to nineteen and half years but judged in generic industry -- told us. Could actually go outside of that -- if she -- to go out -- either way on the leniency and -- the maximum and what could be some appeal with the isn't available hours at Anderson's. Personally -- state. There's no way I think that she's gonna do any thing. Extraordinary year one wave via I personally think shall stay within the guidelines. Publicly for instance stop on -- Europe type of that that she went she was extremely lenient that you -- well below the guy's got lines. The government would back appealed to the United States its Circuit Court of Appeals. And they would make the argument its first bought it. They show that it wasn't substantial. What without reason that so it's it was substantial without reason the government with whatever reason or repeal but I just. That's very rarely done but -- seen at any time lately I don't think it's gonna happen but procedurally it is possible certainly. If she goes way on the upside mr. Nagin. Has been Jenkins or wherever else in my -- it was appealed would appeal that it. I don't see anything you've mentioned before you went to the break about an appeal well normally the the party loses appeals. And mr. -- definitely will preserve all of his appellate rights. I don't know but he hasn't finances to take. Mr. Jenkins to handle the appeal it's not. He may effect and not with the federal public defender -- Italy has appeal and you know that to just about the whole trial. To have an appeal you've got -- -- -- that was committed by the judge has spared in in my opinion. Did everything she committed to preserve the rights of both sides both both the government. And the defense and I think I've seen in the area -- And the lawyers that I watched with -- -- so I just I don't think there's anything on appeal from estimate. In your opinion your expansion what you've seen in other cases doesn't defendant's attitude. Figure into this I mean the guy in government me in no admission of guilt. There was no apology to the citizens of movement New Orleans has been no remorse. Basically never any admission of guilt howl that plane into the sentencing. It absolutely plays and on and it goes way back to where they. The decision whether or not to take a plea bargain. Opera house and sentences yesterday evening in preparation of this interview let's look at some of the public officials who pled guilty. -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- Errant -- the case so involvement representation of that fifteen months. Aaron Broussard 46 months stopping -- and 24 months. Listen to what we're talking about doesn't like from two -- four years all -- public officials who got. Because. They accepted responsibility. You talked about let's go back to my example we gave earlier about filling out your tax return. Well you can't take credit for acceptance of responsibility so when you ask the question using that term. That term is specifically referred to in the federal sentencing guidelines. If the defense that accepts responsibility. He Hershey can can. -- -- -- -- So we know just a few minutes ago we -- to levels we added five -- if you accept responsibility early on you'd get mine is pretty well. So you'd get you'd get penalized -- levels. You'd give money has leveled a credits for level. If you accept responsibility. Mr. Nagin had the opportunity in many of the defendants certainly -- then that the case -- and -- and. Many of those defendants got what's called a five -- latter. That is a letter to the judge by the prosecutors saying. Iran and mr. Bennett. On above and beyond he would keep phrases he has renders substantial assistance to the government -- sure that the lower his. So yeah if you accept responsibility if you work with the government you get a horse. But what that is is that the again if it's mr. Jenkins makes the argument that he has. Dispute with the federal sentencing got one -- the prosecutors many times. Forward defended it was cooperated go -- his -- we agree with the defense attorney we upgrade that that the Probation Department has calculated the guidelines. And added to levels they shouldn't have. The government can agree any. In the -- a. They're not actually -- -- any -- and I can get in any way that I can have read anything that mr. Jenkins says. And to the contrary I think they're gonna try to add on additional level not the least of which is the perjured testimony. And a two level increase now let's look at the job. As the judge take into account acceptance of responsibility. Apps so well in my opinion. Two judges look at that the and it and so it when I was young war in many years ago that was -- judge -- -- -- the two went abroad and used to always say. Acceptance -- a responsibility is the first step towards rehabilitation. Ray Nagin has not admitted any. Not agreeing with anything that happened in the government's case he testified for a couple of days. The debate disputed everything that was presented so to answer your question yes the guidelines provide with to be taken in consideration. And -- judge. In the application of the guidelines in the application of the usually takes into account the attitude of the. While some other very close to -- needs to tell him remain the trial is over it's time for some repentance. Six they would they would gonna take a break here for the news we come back we'll continue this conversation if you would like to weigh in on we have an on operating opinion poll alone would view if you will the judge. Go for leniency -- would you go for the maximum sentencing Ray Nagin nets at WW well dot com. Telephone lines are open to it to 60187. Or 866889087. -- If you get a service attacks text responsibly at 878 -- will be right back after the news. And we also have a text message board if you like to send us -- -- the text keep it concise and to the point at 87870. Right now on operating opinion poll which also ask you to comment on. If you what the judge in the Ray -- case with the letters requesting leniency and has been allowed a lot of them. Would that make you reduce his sentence. 96%. Of our respondents say. No it would have nothing to do within that economy here is what chick foray says about the impact of those letters. -- in some cases they might if the judges really not familiar with the defendant but in this case. You know admit she's very very familiar with the entire Ray Nagin saga -- chick we got some calls on before we get to them. Is there any reason that you see that that could be another delay in the sentencing do you feel confident that July 9 it's common that. As popular compliment that July 9 will be dissenting -- we can't a couple of continuance is already for scheduling reasons so I would be terribly surprised but. You know we're less than two weeks away now I think I think July 9 will be this day. -- let's go to Leone's listening to us so we here at saint -- regret the saint Tammany parish emergency operations senate today Leon in McComb Leon thanks for you call you all -- More. -- it might well want to stop them and didn't. Probably goes -- -- That's a great question it now we will not get twelve months. The judge could. Remained at that point she could tell the United States marshals department handcuffs and taken away I don't think that's gonna happen that's not normally what happens. Particularly at a public corruption case shall probably give him. 45 to sixty days to get his affairs in order but it. Once again. The judge has great discretion in sentencing as well as remand the defendant. It could be that we see Ray -- any cuts that day I don't think it's gonna happen. But it won't be much longer than sixty days he will be reporting to a federal -- More of my question. Thank you very much good I think people listening in calling in -- on nine let's go to Dave and applause line one day thank you for you collier on the think tank with -- for. -- it six but -- outcome I think you get the maximum. A lot out he was that part in me yet every opportunity here to make a deal and those other folks can bask in. No but plead guilty not guilty to make it feels so. So animal run record -- request and ordered it is there any weight. That it could be -- what you value system -- -- not not the XP you know an air quality of church and and seriously and didn't -- And the only thing. There -- insane it got this ball off the he's not the -- for him but he bomb or app it's -- would -- over according. You'd get a doctors here declare them. Incompetence. Matlock work. That's a good question Dave and I and chick maybe he's talking about in the sentencing part of -- may be you know there -- some of those letters that went to the judge pointing out that there was the rest brought about by the stress of Katrina. The problem with that argument is that he testified for a couple of days and everybody got to the he did not look like somebody who was mentally competent. He really looked like someone who was. Carefully overcome overconfident. -- -- So that you can always -- -- -- Jenkins and and now -- you know the record Robert Jenkins has done everything he could do. -- and Ray -- but sometimes. Client just don't take your advice could we see that motion yet. I don't think there's any way we're gonna see that motion and I think it will be summarily dismissed budget variants as the recent motion that he filed about want to have a separate -- To talk about issues she'd she'd denied that motion so I think that motion will not be filed but if -- would be summarily dismissed. I thank you for that call let's go to on the causeway now is Don Don thank you for you call. -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- want to get and once -- out. It. Gives -- other. But I want the court. It could adjust the box. With -- Were there. Actually do it did thank you for the question it's a great question there is a provision. Under the federal -- -- rule 35. Which means judge he is now helping we -- reduces cents. There was talk on the street that mr. saint Pierre is seventeen and have tears that. That he was cooperating from prison that he was giving that government information and that he was point to file that exact motion mr. talking about. Our rule 35. He comes in the play when a defendant gets so large sentence like mr. saint Pierre or that I anticipate. Mr. Nagin is gonna get and sometimes they don't find religion and till it's over. And there is a provision under the federal law I don't think we'll see that the problem with mr. -- situation factually what that is. A lot of the things he could give the government EP at that type of information have prescribed. He waited too long it's too late for the government BP had knowledge of criminal activity for them to move forward and prosecute the criminal activity in market. Question -- but don't what you set the bar right mind up but it bit that would urged. Now -- that include contract that contact urged doughboy tall order -- Parts don't. Like building cock that are. Out there and don't be quiet. I -- if you could hold your answer on that one will be right back Don you can stay with -- if you like we got to take a quick break it would be back with -- for a we're talking about the sentencing of Ray -- coming down on July 9 by judge change American. You can weigh in on the leniency on maximum based on letters that's our opinion poll -- WL dot com or call us 2601878668890878. Text messages at 87870. Will take a look at those right after this time. And we're talking list -- foray about the sentencing of Ray Nagin due to happen now on July 9 and -- -- Eric and then on the bounce follow -- question chick if you would restate his question in your response. Not before we get to that you're talking about renewal efficient light that I got on in the mail. Reminder -- -- the -- -- I can't use mine Peter taken everybody channel four. It's taken Alexander correct transfer -- taken Natalie Shepherd. And the poor legal analyst -- typical patient. Uptick you know there's a cabinet you see going on but believe me the doors open for you welcome on the bar. We kick it back on that question. Certainly. It's been Nagin may have information which has not prescribing may have a conspiracy that that is on going. That -- or overt act that is still taking place. I have seen situations many years ago when I was young prosecutor might be your friend out winners who is now deceased was the greatest. -- coming in new best friend of people who it got convicted in the majors smuggling cases. He reported all around the brain demand and develop the case be any different levels. Of that case if mr. Nagin decided that finally. -- it happened not that he wanted to go to work for the government I am sure that the government would find something useful in the information that he had. Let's go to Brian who's listening to us in late use Brian thank you for you call you'll cheap form. It important to. And understand. Incentives and sure -- keep. -- federal. Conviction and what to present for greatly terms back east and federal. Our. Goal or the -- with the -- group. Just wondered. Why should it out right now you'll receive a non cooperation. Yeah and I am familiar with the Okie state sexuality in the US attorneys that 1983. When he had his first case. Or 82 and it was eighty -- And then when you look at the chart remember we talked earlier about feeling that your taxes and you look at it actually called -- sentencing cable. Any -- -- offense -- in the huge. Scroll over these -- The number of months. Well it gets exponentially greater if you have a high criminal history category. I anticipate what happened in this I suspect what happened and mr. gates case was he had a higher criminal history category and that's why he's got. The the what the sentence that he got. Mr. Nagin I'm sure -- -- level one category one criminal history so he's not going to be penalized. For any prior criminal activity. But it would be my guests that. Former senate they'll -- which severely punished. Forty years prior criminal history. Part of that criminal. Charge what about article went out knowing all the specifics. I would think he got extra levels because that is prior conviction even though it was part but I don't all means and -- of this present report. -- -- All right thank you for you call Brian will be back as if we got time for a few more calls also trick we come back from the break -- like you to give us chicks picked. You know the federal guidelines you've been on top of this case from the beginning of the end you certainly know the man you know the judge elected to give issue best estimate of what that sentence will be when it's handed down. Probably on July 9 will be right back to listen to the think tank on the big 870 WW. Now welcome back into the think tank down -- it took all the Robinette column -- back with you on Monday. One remind you about a big event this weekend boomers and beyond exposed hosted by double WL and -- into account family radio stations of which include magic -- one point nine by -- 57. Mean 97 and three WL thirteen fifty it's at the -- trying senate tomorrow from eight to five. With -- WWL and it goes for radio and TV legal analyst -- -- we've been talking about DO -- in sentencing 95% of you responding to our opinion poll. Say that the letters that it's been sent him requesting leniency from everything from a grand child who would missing but to someone claiming he was a victim of race and discrimination. Would that make you reduced the sentence in 95%. Say absolutely not only 5% saying those -- would have some impact. Chick everything you looked at you'd known demand for years you -- team. Come and go you've you've studied saying he's a level 36. Exactly what the federal sentencing guidelines on. You know the judge very well I don't think there's anyone better qualified to make -- a -- pick up chicks -- if you will on what the -- will be when it comes down to line. I will take you -- On that my best guess is that just -- Campbell's date with with in the guidelines I think she goes towards the bottom of the guidelines. So I'm gonna prognosticate that should give them the lowest level under the guidelines should give him a hundred in 88 months. And as the wind gap what I'll do it not only what like gave you a prediction as to what the sentencing is. A 188 months give you a prediction -- you'll be released from the federal penitentiary if we take 85%. A 188 months. We get a 159. Months that we divide that by twelve we get thirteen and it would be years. Ray Nagin will be 71 years old when he wrote that -- his release date is scheduled for December 20/20. Seven. And he'll be released about this time -- of 20/20 seventh two and a half way house he'll be 71. I'll be 74. And let's hope you and I are still around so we can discuss his release date and what he's going to be wrapped these release from prison. You know we'll do that over fishing trip -- thank you. -- thanks as always for being with -- and you make very complicated issues simplify and brought -- we need to stick foray legal analyst at WW all television as well as. Working with -- us here at WW. -- coming up next hour it's -- saint Tammany parish update we do this once a month Tammany parish president that Bristol will be joining us here at the emergency operations center. In Covington Louisiana today. Back to talk with our also later on Dexter Ricardo he used to the rector of saint Tammany parishes homeland security and this you'll see. Back to talk about hurricane preparation you can never be too prepared for storms will be right back after the news. This is the think tank on WWL AM FM 1053. And streaming worldwide and WWL about it.