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WWL>Topics>>7-24-14 11:10am Garland: on the Affordable Care Act

7-24-14 11:10am Garland: on the Affordable Care Act

Jul 24, 2014|

Garland talks with Sally Pipes from the Pacific Research Institute and Michael Cannon of the Cato Institute about whether the Affordable Care Act is in trouble.

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Automatically Generated Transcript (may not be 100% accurate)

Bob Caro for bull. Act. Affordable Care Act whichever one you like. That's what where did things get about today. Attitude of always looking you're one liberal publication and Moreland conservative publication. Kind of radically different stories. About something that -- and -- at all. Two courts. Gave ruling on the peace. Obama care you know shoes. And they do screen would be -- can do and one of the -- court. And we've got a couple gifts on -- and understand exactly. What was decided and what may happen -- wouldn't sell -- -- with this. Presidency you know Pacific research institute contributing writer to Forbes. Selling -- sure appreciate it goes all wars are right here. Tell me what what happened it was a DC court and and -- Virginia court -- and. Right on Tuesday to -- came out the first 1 in the morning came out a little but he three judge panel. -- this US Court of Appeals and the BBC districts circuit. And update the pretext. Panel the book to the one saying that he subsidies aren't being paid to people who were getting their coverage. Three -- healthcare that got 36 states in the union. -- did not set up their own exchanges and therefore are having the federal government operate their exchange there was no. Allowance in the law for people to get subsidies it. It's they were part of at the state work honesty exchanged so that was. -- -- -- -- you that would deposit Wheeling because in the Lockett said it had to be get a subsidy he had to be in a state exchange. Then later date the fourth Circuit Court of Appeals. -- ruled in the opposite direction something that. You know it the intent of the law what to provide. Subsidies to everyone regardless of whether they were in the state or federal exchanged so. That is basically what happened on Tuesday. So we've got and number of something -- what happened on one. Unwieldy. The US court appeal and the DC circuit will and go to a full on -- channel four and in appeal. And which case it bit nerve racking because they're the majority of it's like diplomat. Court are now -- Democrat. And then the other issue it will there be an appeal of the fourth circuit. Decision. Ultimately I think this is going to go to the US Supreme Court. Of course we have to get and third in order for the capital that all kind of think it will go to the Hewitt in court later this year or early next year believe that we hear it all depends on you know what they're not grapples with these two decision from the field. And observed naive little kid. Raised over your cajun country in civic good as the big tall orders that courts were for the wall. But -- the more I do this showed the more I talked to experts. It sounds like quarts or four liberal since it's a liberal court in conservatives. -- its conservative court. And their view of the power or via knowledgeable lawyers -- -- shocked. And world we moving more towards. Conservative liberal law rather than -- reading the law. Well you're absolutely right -- that the purpose of the court is to it. To read and interpret the law but its feet. But not not based on their personal beliefs and. Right at a but it seems -- right seems more and more that you know people that are -- shopping their court trapping. And that there's more and more sort of left light you know so and so it's on the left their predictable bit -- don't look on the bright talent the court. How that the court -- -- break happening in the US Supreme Court. Right now I mean there are. Three considered conserve definitely conservative actor against Thomas. Scalia and Alito Justice Kennedy. What the Republican appointees but it's Alec unclear how -- -- devote an adept at Robert. There was also supposed to be more on the conservative side just -- Robert of course Indy. On June 282012. I'm. -- ruling that the individual mandate. You know allowed obamacare could be -- to stand. I'm so that was a bit of the chocolate and on the other side we have the four liberal deficit intend to vote. You know instinctive -- I think the court is becoming more and more political. Which which is which which it's a shame because that's not the role of the court they're too. To interpret what the blog reading means. Or it looks. Take a break her -- come back. A read from the liberal media and then from the conservative -- given. Idea aboard for -- be brought it to maybe over a minute bits and pieces have been correct come right -- elective -- and give comments. Obamacare. It seemed like this is a credit the big threat depending on what happened to be goes. All the way to the Supreme Court. It could force another vote to -- tree -- re bribing -- in congress. What are your thoughts to receive 0170. -- questions told freight. Nationwide and six exhilarated nuns rule heats up. All right we're gonna have experts who's our troops related to -- Alter what the liberal meeting saying. Liberal misleading you saying we've had in his health care ruling by a federal court you'll score that is. Millions of low and moderate income people could fund themselves without coverage and facing big premium builds. On the conservative side they're bright. It's as simple it the nation's second highest court. Ruling that Obama cares upon -- what congress enacted. Not. How all of the Obama administration is written it. And so consequently. It's it's they call it legitimate. So to oppose him rulings. Wardrobe where she could. Cause a lot of changes to Obama care. Whether we have doctor. Chartered a major doctor. Good solid college presidency you have to search institute. And a broader report. Months ago you bring -- so Mubarak called break and Morgan says the Euro would selling. Yeah. But. That. It as a court which suspected we. To. Put it. And Obama right if you think it is speeches. And out of regular. And what went through the academic think because. You know a -- -- then figured that would be active in the Supreme Court justices. That well against it and -- -- do. People and about people and enjoy it. Supreme Court that yet to -- -- -- Leo. And it. Imposing a Celebrex. The court shouldn't be removed for Obama care enough to mature ball. Right well I think you know I'm -- caller suggested that it may be two year of course the president on in January Akron seventeen -- out of office. I think it was going to -- a lot after I mean it could be that the court well you don't get the a position to review. -- -- the BK in early November and then you know that would be that you know that accurately predicted -- been -- -- could be. Considered and we probably the ruling you know by the end of June 20 sixteenths. It's not and the followed 2015 Coke. You know Howell. As the -- said earlier we had no idea how to put Robert well. Come down on this week. He probably -- -- a person can -- They need the decision we don't know where Justice Kennedy is I think it. -- -- The Supreme Court ruled that the based on the law as it is written that these subsidies for those people receiving. -- receiving subsidies. In the 36 states that are have are in the exchanges operated by the federal government. I think -- it that ruling comes down saying that is correct. This is probably going to be our big. I'm the implosion. Obamacare as a as we know that -- we've seen you know that the the president and the administration has made so many changes. To the -- with going to congress which of course is what it's supposed to happen so it's going to be a very good thing -- I don't think we have to wait that long I think. I think that we're gonna see on the Supreme Court taking it because it is such petty and important. Issue that it is really. I believe will go to court. Limitless it doesn't bode well as its new bunker -- blows up what do what do you see happening there and are Republicans ready within the alternative. About the only -- a big issue Garland that means in last summer. Newt Gingrich a former. He congressman. Spoke at. Republican advance saying. You know that the Republicans had no plans to replace obamacare that is not true that Republicans are many Republican plans to replace obamacare whether it's -- senator Coburn. I'm senator Alexander -- hatched and are whether I -- from the center of the Republican Study Committee. Whether it's from congressman Paul Ryan there are a lot of a plant so there the issue with both of them are pretty much the same with a few tweaks I think the Republicans. -- goal is to get together and come up with a single replacement. Plan that they can all stand behind because. If obamacare look down repeal it's one thing that they have to have a replacement again that I have in my book the truth about it I mean the cure for obamacare. I mean what is the replacement plan I think you know we feel like being in the polls. 53%. Of Americans would like to see this law repealed and replaced they don't like it more and more people. Finding out when they signed up for coverage on an exchange in in their state. That doctor that they went to before is not in the network now -- becoming upset by that. It's you know your doctor your hair got -- -- is very important to people so and then we're also seeing that LP. Eight million people at supposedly. You know -- signed up for coverage on the exchange at about fifteen to 20% you'll still have not paid their premiums so they go to the doctor. I'm they are they are covered so there. A lot of discontent with this we need a plan. The Republicans need to you know have a plan that empowered. Doctors and patients and not the federal government and so. I think that says they really got to focus on this and that mid term election of you know we're coming up in November so they better get. And they've got a great opportunity now with the -- the ruling and called big purses are well that got a really good opportunity to get their act together in and get tight. When things Nomo was curious. Our own. Congress. Senator. Conservative types. Have been there for awhile. Nebraska moves in -- from what's the plan. They can give me bits and pieces but Obama says you're taking a pretty detailed look at it and and and it seems like there were only ago fuel sources. A big money or. Where there's potential for big cuts. But they're politically untenable. Hero -- -- you can do it you're not gonna get reelected. Shall we did. The political hot stone. To do something that we gnomes work. Well you know I think it's likely I think to keep it. Paul shot 53% of Americans would like to see that legislation. You know repealed and replaced they're not happy with that. It and certainly what we saw you know with the veterans administration I mean I testified for the senate help committee back in March. I was talking about the Canadian healthcare system and how the government runs -- in that long -- list ration care. The lack of access -- the latest drugs and treatments. Well you know like that I could see a couple of things happening. Under the veterans' administration here in the US because it is the single Payer system that the government I'm totally. And of course the couple months later all of this province is waiting list of people dying because they couldn't get. Get care came came to pass the American people that are weak the American people are waking up for the -- government is not the solution to -- You know some of the issues that we have other health care system so we need to build assistant. Where we get away from employer based coverage and put individuals in charge of their care we need to reduce these costly mandates you know under obamacare. Speed in addition to policy mandates there are ten. Mandate under the essential benefit plan that adds more and more of the cost. Care we need to do state based medical malpractice reform stricter than. I have re. Because they are programs that are you know out of control in terms of cost doctors aren't taking patients. It's certainly be seen under Obama care with the expansion. Of Medicaid program for low income Americans. You know more and more doctors are refusing to take Medicaid patients which means they used emergency rooms. As they have you know in the past -- an increasing rate and that's uncompensated care so a lot can be done we we all -- there are some great plans of their. Empowering parents say doctors and patients and not the government but we have to -- Republicans have been a plan that they can. Run on educate people that. Because people -- part of health care you know ground is very complicated and a lot of politicians don't like to touch it but you know they need to. Need to get you know explain to the American people lie a pro replacement plan that they have would be better and increasing local government. Little Ochocinco -- one part of -- heard talk about it. Giving people responsibility. For the girl and payment of procurement savings for a while and watch them work. I I think we see pretty large parts of this population thought that through the use of drugs or. I didn't have -- punitive they received for this sort of got student loans that I can field for I'm barely living from pay check to pay check. We do -- we end up with -- millions of people that live there. Squandered the money that they're -- going to manage themselves. Or don't have the money. To get the structures and ordered two men or we do then just say we're Euro -- or do they might end up with the emergency room. The -- -- as you know in this country you know what can be denied health -- even illegal immigrants I -- you can you know her. You know about that as we're seeing in Massachusetts and patent we're saying now is in the in the in this country with the Medicaid expansion -- people. They are on Medicaid but a doctoral and docket their increasingly not taken and put more pressure. On emergency rooms. Not -- health savings accounts you know are really -- twenty million Americans now have health savings account which has been around -- eight year. We're really saying that putting doctors and patients. In charge of letting people put money away every month tax free. And then using their agencies as as -- -- that -- that have to be combined with high deductible insurance plan at this is putting doctors and patients. In charge and reducing the cost of health care about. That's one rate for -- people you know today who are you know low income they are eligible for Medicaid and a lot. Is that generally don't bill signed up because. They know they can't get a doctor they'd rather go to the emergency room but we do need to I think it was the -- wanna do one thing that should be providing. Front maybe 5200 billion dollars. To -- state based. Risk pools so that those people who are about -- line the federal poverty level Ella pill. Eligible for Medicaid so that they can actually get coverage. Until we get properly functioning system that we have a large pool. -- of people young people healthy people. And we can bring in you know older people sicker people people around -- -- and they will be covered. But you don't want it and throwing out our whole health care system where people come. From Canada and other countries because we do have the latest in pharmaceuticals the latest in biologic treatments. We really do have. You know the finest rounds surgeons in the world but we don't -- throughout the second because I think we're well people in America go -- Canadians can come to this country and -- pocket. They do have an escape -- if we do not repeal and replace obamacare where are we going to go because the best kids local at a Madison. And and we had an assistant. So only -- always pleasure to have you on the sure appreciate it's -- -- good. Right more often portable character or Obama care that your one you call. Are welcome back word figure about a -- -- Carol portable Acura which are one who only believe. To -- borrowings this would diametrically. Opposed. Of water and according to the liberal media jumps is that millions of low patents it is could cause this. Millions of low and moderate income people. Do you have signed up for obamacare comply and -- Well coverage replacing big premium builds. And the conservative approach says that for. It is the invasions on its second highest court. And recently ruled that Obama -- of Poland but what congress passed in acted not out of the administration went back then and re wrote it. So I understand. It. What happens now how serious is it is if at all. Turn to Michael can -- -- -- ten minutes from Michael director of the health policy kid we institute Michael welcome back appreciated. All credit of what what do you see in the news is that something that. Could call of the implosion of Obama cares -- something that's gonna cause it to be Brit Britain and with the. Well it certainly has that potential. And and the way it could -- that outcome is that. What the whole big ruling means. Is that the IRS. President Obama. Has been violated the law. -- in January by issuing subsidies. In 36 states that chose not to establish. I'll answer -- exchange under the patient protection or character Obama it's so. What the court ruling did and that's because the law says that those health insurance subsidies are available. All week through an exchange quote that was by the statement. So the subsidies that the Obama administration has been issuing in the 36 states including Louisiana. But federal exchanges. Are legal. If those subsidies disappear. Then what happens it is. It does increase the cost concerns that the people in Louisiana exchange or the other 38. Is what it does. Is it. Reveal to them the full caught. On the very expensive insurance obamacare requires them to purchase to prevent the Obama administration from again illegally. Shifting the cost of that insurance. From the premium -- to the taxpayer with these subsidies. It. And what the Obama administration is afraid of is that. -- people's seat -- full cost of the insert he's required to purchase. Then. There will be a huge backlash against the law and heated democratic members of congress will be. Open to reopening. There's other impact of -- the ruling that I have to mention though because. That same time it would put an end to those illegal subsidies. It would also put an entity in the -- taxes that the Obama administration is imposing on people in the media promote those -- 35 states. Taxes that congress will -- not offer it for example. And and these these penalties the taxes are tied. To the subsidy so. That the president has been offering these illegal subsidies in the Louisiana. Automatically triggers. Taxes. Or -- objects to in legal tax is about 2101000. Louisiana residents but my. That's actually conservative estimates so right now persons. January the president has been subjecting more than 200000 Louisiana residents to the individual mandate -- On lawful. And even though the court in whole big said that that would legally can do that he's continuing to do and it goes. He is beyond even that because those subsidies also trigger penalties against employers in Louisiana under. The employer mandate in -- So by on -- goes on lawful subsidies lead here he is subjected to those employer mandate taxes. More than 6000 Louisiana firms at more than one point two million Louisiana workers. So. Do so would that would DC circuit will the president has violated the law. If it was not a small way that he's been violating the law he literally protecting people. Without statutory authority and spending. Taxpayer dollars without statutory authority and affecting. Hundreds of thousands of billions. Over a billion people in this state of Louisiana. I've been educated on the show to understand. Court system that I thought. Was based on law. Purely based on law is not in large forward it's based on political persuasion. Everything every -- your conservative liberal media says the Obama administration. Is gonna try to appeal is to -- appellate court. Where eleven members resides seven Democrat. Or Republican appointees. Isn't gonna be able to do that and how fetched. Well that the legacy aspect of -- cases. That the two judges on the DC circuit who voted 22. Put it into these illegal taxes and subsidies reported by Republicans and so people are saying hello this is the parties and opinion it's never mind that the judge who authored the opinion. That is is his nomination to the court which supported by prominent Democrats including one senator Barack Obama. -- -- -- fortunes portions bipartisanship but it is level -- -- by Democrats. And there's been times people who sit and say oh what once it reaches the full DC circuit citizens this three judge panel. There will be democratic appointees Italy by Republican appointees and that will win The Beatles he did that that is partisanship right there. In addition. That they dissent in this case was offered by a eighties democratic appointees who began his opinion. By -- attacking. The motives of the plaintiffs which is not a legal argument. So. And so others that are not partisanship. That play each year that you're right courts don't always and he. Followed just the law but there are different ways of interpreting the law that are. That are. Favored by people to their ideological persuasions that more that that partisanship. And I really don't know which way this is going to go right -- procedurally you know who's going to appeal. And to what course. Either beautiful DC circuit that's full fourth circuit or Supreme Court out of the courts are gonna do. In any of those cases either way what do you know this is actually joked that. A colleague of mine and -- tell about these cases. We say that the to -- against the government here is ironclad which means that. The chances of success in court are -- solid 20% to. A terrible others who were ponder of words -- wouldn't call and again we come back on again always refused to talk. Thank you about it. You can articulate bright won't come right back what do you think to procedural one -- so please his consistency you'd do you do you think Obama cares -- to. Collapse we've been told over over in the -- never happen. We got some court decisions that at least some conservative and and so we've on the shows. Could be imminent what do you take two basic 0172038680. Dollar and zero cent. Are a good -- good about Obama careless go to the callers horribly in Mobile, Alabama temperature cocoa. It's there yet. -- -- And the good. Well I'm sorry that there that there are -- uncertainty -- it but that anyway the question. Are quality people all through affordable care for. People -- it is currency. Award in its intensity war and answer our beat them that their word. Their own program. -- -- -- question it the way to go here or I'll release and -- it is it's been. It is -- the in the worked in the -- -- -- Field life insurance. As -- When we got insurance premiums. Are the same article even before. The -- at the K with it. You actors. That candidate school -- static I think it would yeah I think insurance companies to it and now to the to increase premium revenue. And so anyway I just questioned why so many people. -- -- I've got to. And through -- that I believe that aggravates a lot of people blood. It's evident side seats and to have been doing this show. Is that if you're a conservative funeral like anything Obama does Perry in story. If you're liberal. You know again anything George Bush and a period in -- story. And what -- will do now from what they will continue to. Is fight themselves usually to a -- studio and in the meantime does so well we. This year. The United States who's -- -- an eight team percent of our GDP. On health care. That's four obamacare really picked him aren't. -- six percentage Ford's book Netherlands the next highest spender. And this is all computed in the thirty top conference in the world. Of those six percentage points were over the Netherlands. Amounts to an additional one. Trillion dollars in spending. And the burden of ever -- slow and lost wages insurance -- Taxes out of pocket care and other costs will be more than 8000. Dollars. And I don't know about -- wanting to conservatives. And and all the of the stuff plug Doan sure was in Britain wasn't in broad blogs. -- convincingly that Obama carry me and I'll be the answer. Okay. Incentive to come by a single Republican senators who owned stores and Republican congressman and so on and so as a plan. Get together. Put Obama -- one side and your plan on the other side. And tell me I get to change that it's because long before George Bush. Long before President Obama. We had problems with -- our health care. Or on sustainable. That is the basic -- that neither conservatives. Or liberals can contest. So give me another play. Her own web site short tall. The photo via. We're going to be in -- by the energy when we come back a number of convictions. Concerning coal fired plants. Revelations. Of -- -- you know more she'll blow again -- than we are broad run. World we're now producing more than anybody else in the world. Lot of changes would try to better understand all that means commitment. Called -- but it would be it is the big -- Over Tokyo brigade celebrity yeah mortal -- at the --

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